Hypocrites on this site

[AlbertaFarmer5]

I can't believe I am typing this, but I agree with ChuckChuck on this issue:

I am wondering what you expect governments and commodity groups to do about over supplied markets and falling prices?

Most of you guys hate government intervention in the market so what do you suggest they do to resolve the declining profits in a free market system?

Are you expecting them to bail you out? Put in price controls on inputs and machinery? Pay farmers the cost production? What do you want?

The grain companies and input suppliers are just doing what their shareholders expect them to do, which is make lots of profit.

I've asked my fellow producers this question before, since you disapprove of the price the free market offers when there is over supply, what mechanism do you propose to use to ration supply to keep it close to demand? The patent answer, that the government should pay us more, or the end user should be forced to pay us more because there is only 2 cents worth of Oats in a box of Cheerios, will result in even greater production, and even greater surpluses, requiring even greater subsidies, completely distorting the price signal which was trying to tell us to throttle back on production. The only thing that might work is productions quota's, but I can only imaging the screaming that us farmers would do if government told us what to grow and when, not to mention that our competition would happily fill the gap left by our lower production and laugh at us all the way to the bank.

It may very well be that Canadian agriculture will be no different than manufacturing, and we are unable to compete when we have high taxes, high regulations, high wages, and a hostile climate. Should government be supporting every money losing manufacturer ( like they do the quebec favorite), and if not, why are farmers any different?

We all sound the same, government is the problem don't tax me, don't tell me what to do, let the free market function. Until the free market tells us that it doesn't want our product at the price we like, then suddenly we demand that government step in and fix the obviously broken free market for us.

Personally, I believe sink or swim should be the policy for all businesses, keep the government out of it completely, that includes crop insurance, trade tariffs, subsidies, financing, preferential tax treatment, etc. So long as the playing field is level across the country, we will survive, the surpluses coming from these programs just gets bid into land costs anyways.

[tweety]

What we need is more producer dollars spent on production research. More fertilizer and fungicide trials.

[furrowtickler]

What we need is more producer dollars spent on production research. More fertilizer and fungicide trials.

Wrong ... put it into soil and plant health.
That will reduce fertilizer and the need for fungicide..

[farmaholic]

I don't think it's that easy or cut and dried! We aren't producing widgets in a factory and know our production in advance or what's being produced around the world because all Producers are at the same risk as we are the world over.

Besides its ultimately food!

So next time you grow that certain crop and everyone else in the world grew a good crop except you or your general area....and you're dealing with depressed prices on poor yeilds and not being profitable... somehow you see that as a poor choice?

Sometimes the signals are received AFTER the fact. ....a little late to change strategies isn't it?

What did I say in another thread?.... seems sometimes there's no demand for the grain you grow the year you grew it!

Also remember everyone else is receiving the same signals and may be chasing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow(growing last year's shining star) or avoiding last year's dog (dropping the falling star).

Meanwhile everyone else supplying goods and services and leaching has been paid!

Good luck with your 2018 cropping plans....LUCK being the key word.......my goodness! Besides how many real and viable options do you have where you farm? Can you grow soybeans?Can you grow chickpeas? Can you grow quality malt barley? Can you grow durum? ....you can plant and grow any of them, but are they suitable and will you be successful. .....so while you look for an option to avoid being bitten by the dog....you might be planning for failure in doing so.

Give it back to the Indians and release the buffalo.

[oneoff]

Well if there is a 5% to 15% oversupply then just maybe everyone producing just 5% to 15% LESS would simply solve the problem.

If prices improved by more than 5 to 15% would farmers not actually be better off financially?.

Now remember that dumping 5% of production in the ocean, denaturing that amount (for traditional use only) or sending it away for starving persons (etc.) who could never participate in any marketplace anyways...are other viable options to reducing a tiny fraction of supply that depresses prices of every other unit that the marketplace automatically assumes is available at firesale prices.


Not that any of above could ever work in the real world of monopolies, near monopolies and control by handfuls of businesses or countries, or NOT













producing that wh

[bucket]

The Indian government is supporting their farmers now....although first they let a few thousand commit suicide to get the program and the import tax in place ....


I would like to see some transparent reporting of sales so farmers can better decisions throughout the season....

Maybe the graincos knew that import tax was coming and held off contracts to India or maybe there were no sales ....every week in the states there is a report of current and future sales so everyone involved ....farmers ,graincos, end users , and speculators can make informed decisions. ...

And it's government regulated. ...

My farm can't compete against farmers that can grow record production then have the price drop and get a government payment on a record crop....that's what happens in the states and other countries
....and it's what is keeping the price of everything coming onto the farm up....


Then look at the money going into public infrastructure in other countries to make them more competitive. ....


Things have changed and other countries look to their age sectors as a resource...in Canada resources get flagged as a bad thing. ....to our own demise. ..

Sadly agriculture is a productive economic renewable resource and is treated like shit by governments here....

[LEP]

Albertafarmer 5. +1. Well said.

Everyone in the ag industry is not there to serve me. Things ebb and flow. I farmed alot of years where breaking even was the entire focus. We ran lean and mean.

Now we are doing quite well. Maybe not making as much as the hay days but very far from breakeven.

So things will get tighter next year and I suggest everyone examine every expenditure. Maybe cut back where you can. Maybe some those paying $140 an acre rent or $2700 an acre for land will get rationalized and we start over again.

But more government is not the answer.

[bgmb]

One could only dream of a free market. We have a few grain companies controlling 80% of the grain trade. Look at the seed or fertilizer business, no different.

Railways, Free market lol

Just cause the cwb is gone does not mean we have a free market.

[SASKFARMER3]

Really.

The Indian gov just slapped you in the F#$King Face with a huge tariff.

And you blame the farmer.

I blame our brain dead PM who should be worried about his country and deal with them.

We import lots of useless shit from them well its a 150% and guess what those business people in India that are the richest not some useless farmers will get their gov to change bullshit programs.

Some of you have no concept how this whole thing works.


Plus the other thing our useless producer groups are that useless.

[bucket]

You know who the useless checkoff groups have to call for an international trade barrier resolution.....the useless federal government. ...

What's the point in paying checkoffs if ultimately you need the government to solve the problem....

Others here talk about an oversupply then why research for higher producing varieties that end up causing the current oversupply problem?

Of course I don't believe there is an oversupply ....no one is looking for solutions to feed hungry people. ...otherwise we would be currently short of supply....at least that's what experts have said for over 30 years ....we need more food...

[sk_wheatking]

I'm just wondering whatever happened to our green initiative regarding biofuels? The government wants it and we can supply the canola for bio diesel and the wheat for ethanol while at the same time shorting the canola crush market for Cargill and Richardson and the like for their oil crush outfits thereby raising commodity prices because they are now forced to compete with biofuel ? Maybe I'm stupid.

[tweety]

Wrong ... put it into soil and plant health.
That will reduce fertilizer and the need for fungicide..

Sarcasm did a fly by lol.

[ajl]

Trouble is that no one would recognize a free market these days since it has not been around since the 60's. Why is debt so high and interest rates so low? Never exist under a free market. Central banks are manipulating this market by printing money. Reality is that free markets are long gone around the world so then everyone is a hypocrite. What would you do if your land values drop in half tomorrow. Some areas in the US such as central and western portions of Kansas and Nebraska that has already happened. (albeit from ridiculous levels). So while I am in favor of letting markets do their thing, I am certainly not confident of survival should they do that. If AG craps the bed like the energy sector, what are people in Canuckistan going to be doing? Yes we are pumping more oil that ever before, but do to less investment that will decline over the next few years. Nothing is viable in Canuckistan due to excessive regulation, poor geography and climate, and east vs west disfunction.

[GDR]

Totally agree AB5. It doesn't end with grain marketing either. As a group farmers complain about rents and land prices yet everyone keeps putting their $$ up and pushing prices further. Same story on machinery prices, do you think prices would stay where they are if farmers didn't line up to get the first order on the new model in your neighborhood. Do we really need all the bells and whistles on the machines of today. Dealer told me it's pretty tough to sell anything not fully loaded up, if it's got all the bells and whistles they can't keep them in Stock.

[bucket]

Went to auto dealerships looking for regular cab 3/4 ton plain jane truck for farm and they say no one wants them... how about used ....can't keep them on the lot... go figure.


Not sure about everyone else here but once I get combine set for a crop I rarely change anything but I could stop and do it manually and not lose much time....