Hypocrites on this site

[danny W1M]

The United Nations, wouldn't be happy with Trudeau if he were to promote/legislate the use of biofuels in Canada, from grains stocks.

That would go completely against the "cheap food agenda" that the United Nations currently has in place.

Wouldn't be viewed favorably for Canada seeking a security council seat.

Besides, that would put power back in the hands of the west and corn farmers in central Canada.

[wmoebis]

The United Nations, wouldn't be happy with Trudeau if he were to promote/legislate the use of biofuels in Canada, from grains stocks.

That would go completely against the "cheap food agenda" that the United Nations currently has in place.

Wouldn't be viewed favorably for Canada seeking a security council seat.

Besides, that would put power back in the hands of the west and corn farmers in central Canada.

Don't know much about UN but why isn't our gov't or producer groups fighting tarriffs through them?

[Klause]

Don't know much about UN but why isn't our gov't or producer groups fighting tarriffs through them?

WTO handles tariffs.


What's the point? India wasn't really buying before the tariff and they put in the highest percentage they are legally under the WTO allowed to put in place.

[sk_wheatking]

I wonder the same thing , would it not be a good fit into the green climate change agenda ? It’s like bio fuel in Canada has been swept under the rug , when the Liberals should be endorsing it .

Furrow guys on here don't want to ask these kinds of questions they would rather fight amongst each other about over production and how much land costs I guess. The green initiative thing is what should be making western Canadian ag business a lucrative enterprise really. There is NO MONEY IN FARMING FOOD GRAINS!!!! Trudeau wants green energy well here it is. But wait....it doesn't benefit Quebec or Ontario. Reading the know it all's on here and the fighting and bullshit artists gets sickening after a while. Your right furrow but no one is asking the questions about our bio fuel industry.

[SASKFARMER3]

I’m for all that it would work. I would even let bombardier have one. Food is a dead horse. If can’t beat him join him but doing nothing isn’t working

[Klause]

Furrow guys on here don't want to ask these kinds of questions they would rather fight amongst each other about over production and how much land costs I guess. The green initiative thing is what should be making western Canadian ag business a lucrative enterprise really. There is NO MONEY IN FARMING FOOD GRAINS!!!! Trudeau wants green energy well here it is. But wait....it doesn't benefit Quebec or Ontario. Reading the know it all's on here and the fighting and bullshit artists gets sickening after a while. Your right furrow but no one is asking the questions about our bio fuel industry.

Ethanol and biodiesel are a pipe dream. Especially in today's input intensive agriculture you don't get anything out of it that you didn't put in...

[Oliver88]

except it has nothing to do with climate change , none of trudeaus buddies can make any money off it . and don't forget this whole charade is about reducing economic power in the west , it's just that simple . first oilpatch , then Ag . I guess Alta and sask had got to big for their britches..... they aren't going to use biofuel because it might help Ag in the west

This is 100% the reason why.

Well said CaseIh.

[sk_wheatking]

Ethanol and biodiesel are a pipe dream. Especially in today's input intensive agriculture you don't get anything out of it that you didn't put in...

Your right.

**** I'm stupid. No wonder I'm a worthless unsuccessful piece of shit......

Oh well you can't win em all.

[grassfarmer]

... There is NO MONEY IN FARMING FOOD GRAINS!!!! ...

Except as Sheepwheat pointed out the current affluence - the expensive land, big rents, all the new machinery, the multiple holidays are a result of the prices you've been getting. Came past a place today laying pipeline drainage on 3 quarters - times must be hard. Most of you were crying in your beer recently at the suggestion you might have to pay a little more tax on your profits in excess of $200,000 after allowing for a return to your management. What a bunch of whiney cry babies.

[Hamloc]

I can't believe I am typing this, but I agree with ChuckChuck on this issue:



I've asked my fellow producers this question before, since you disapprove of the price the free market offers when there is over supply, what mechanism do you propose to use to ration supply to keep it close to demand? The patent answer, that the government should pay us more, or the end user should be forced to pay us more because there is only 2 cents worth of Oats in a box of Cheerios, will result in even greater production, and even greater surpluses, requiring even greater subsidies, completely distorting the price signal which was trying to tell us to throttle back on production. The only thing that might work is productions quota's, but I can only imaging the screaming that us farmers would do if government told us what to grow and when, not to mention that our competition would happily fill the gap left by our lower production and laugh at us all the way to the bank.

It may very well be that Canadian agriculture will be no different than manufacturing, and we are unable to compete when we have high taxes, high regulations, high wages, and a hostile climate. Should government be supporting every money losing manufacturer ( like they do the quebec favorite), and if not, why are farmers any different?

We all sound the same, government is the problem don't tax me, don't tell me what to do, let the free market function. Until the free market tells us that it doesn't want our product at the price we like, then suddenly we demand that government step in and fix the obviously broken free market for us.

Personally, I believe sink or swim should be the policy for all businesses, keep the government out of it completely, that includes crop insurance, trade tariffs, subsidies, financing, preferential tax treatment, etc. So long as the playing field is level across the country, we will survive, the surpluses coming from these programs just gets bid into land costs anyways.

I happen to agree with your whole post. I think for example to blame government or grainco's when India implement's an import tariff is a little simplistic. They are in a situation of oversupply and let's compliment the Indian government, they went to bat for their farmers by protecting their market. I also believe there is no doubt that Canadian government policy will increase our costs. Let's be realistic the carbon tax is supposed to in theory reduce our use of carbon based fuels. Can we become more efficient? I am sure that technology to lower fertilizer use as an example will be developed but the equipment required to utilize this technology won't come cheap. Anybody that thinks that anything coming out of the Trudeau-Butts brain trust will benefit western Canadian farmers is dreaming, they want to create a system of dependence on government. Anyone that can't see that isn't looking or has their head up their ass. From my perspective get the government the hell out of my business I would rather sink or swim on my own. Good topic Alberta5, good post. 😉

[the big wheel]

So which board or producer group are you on Hamloc because it's really beyond embarrassing if you're actually a farmer and not to understand what's going on around as you put it the simplistic view of sink or swim.

[Hamloc]

So which board or producer group are you on Hamloc because it's really beyond embarrassing if you're actually a farmer and not to understand what's going on around as you put it the simplistic view of sink or swim.

First off certainly not on any board. Simplistic view of sink or swim? Let me turn it around then big wheel. What government program that exists today couldn't you live without? Personally I am undoubtably a fan of government crop research. I have to admit I would hate to see that disappear. I think it is prudent to study what crop varieties work for our climate. I am not in agristability, waste of money as far as I am concerned. With both cattle and grain my margins don't generally fluctuate enough to make it worthwhile. Agri-invest, I participate could I live without it, certainly. Marked fuel rebate, if the government would turf the carbon tax I would gladly give up the marked fuel rebate. As for subsidization of crop insurance, I take out crop insurance, if the subsidy ended it wouldn't rock my world, I would have to re-evaluate my participation. I certainly realize most countries in the world subsidize food production and perhaps we need that to compete. As I said Trudeau and Notley will make our job much less profitable but I still agree with Alberta5's outlook. I also appreciate the fact that European countries as an example are far more willing to support their farmers than Canadians but look at the federal government they can't even figure out how to properly pay their employees, what real salvation can you expect from such a group of incompetents. Do you really want them more involved in your farm?

[Oliver88]

Ethanol and biodiesel are a pipe dream. Especially in today's input intensive agriculture you don't get anything out of it that you didn't put in...

The point is since this green energy farce is being pushed on us we should try to benefit and use it to lower our grain supplies. Ethanol and biodiesel are ways of reducing our grain inventories and is helpful for futures prices.

I think your argument is from an energy usage point of view and others are coming from a point of view to reduce inventories/increase demand for grain & oilseeds.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

I wonder the same thing , would it not be a good fit into the green climate change agenda ? It’s like bio fuel in Canada has been swept under the rug , when the Liberals should be endorsing it .

Not picking on you Furrow, just a general observation.

The biofuel issue is just as hypocritical as the marketing issue. We expect governments to support/endorse/subsidize/mandate these fuels. Perhaps we are the ones who need to be taking this initiative. Currently, ethanol is selling for a significant discount to RBOB, and the world wants ethanol for emissions reduction. Ethanol doesn't need government support, it just needs investment. Economically, right now, it makes sense. Local ethanol plant is paying more for off grade wheat than elevators are, DDG's are sold out constantly. Why wait for the slothful pace of government incompetence to increase this market. If we can produce ethanol and biofuel cheaper than gasoline and diesel, then invest in that.

As for the EROI(Energy Return On Investment) while logically, it must be positive, otherwise it couldn't possibly come out cheaper than RBOB( that is to say, it would cost more fuel to create it, than the final product is worth). But that doesn't mean that it is positive enough to make any sense, when EROI needs to be many multiples of breakeven in order for society to function. Even at 2 times, we are only spinning our wheels. But money talks louder than acronyms and ratio's.

[SASKFARMER3]

The whole point on Bio Fuel with Gov help is they are bringing in a Carbon tax that is just a Tax it will do shit all F#$K All and nothing at All to help save the planet.
It is a bullshit scheme dreamt up by a Fairy dust princess that we have running this country and his henchmen.

So why not actually get funding from that useless program and go balls to the wall with Ethanal and Bio Diesel and build this country.

Offer Grants or Loans for start ups hell we can all produce Bio Diesel on our own farm.

But as it sits now the Carbon tax will just fill a few with Solar and really not accomplish anything but make our costs higher.

Your from alberta you should realize your not a booming province like you once were and Nut case has only been going for a few years. If we give Trudeau another term. Venezuela of the north here we come.