Furrow Bang on!

[Oliver88]

How will farmers recoup the carbon taxes imposed on them? Diesel, freight, chemicals, parts, grain shipping, fertilizer, increased equipment costs, almost everthing a farmer does will be taxed. Do you think they will send you a cheque, hahahaha. Not funny!!!! This could actually make farming unsustainable!!!!

Come on Breadwinner you are missing the point of this carbon scam.
When you are out of business your fossil fuel footprint will be smaller.....meanwhile Gore, Suzuki and friends will continue to heat multiple mansions and jetset to climate conferences.

[chuckChuck]

Get ready for Ontario size electricity bill.

New wind power is cheaper than new coal fired facilities. Especially cheaper than adding in carbon capture and storage. Prices for wind have come away down.

Sask Power is faced with retrofitting several coal units or shutting them down in the next few years. If they do anything then retrofitting over to natural gas would be a good interim step with large carbon emission reductions over coal.

Solar is currently a cheaper option under net metering for many farms and residences. Farms currently pay 11.8 cents per kwh and residences 14.2 cents per kwh. I have done a rough estimate that solar will cost 7-8 cents per kwh over the life span of 30 years. Panels come with a 25 year output guarantee of 80% output by year 25, which is the industry standard.

If Saskpower is forced by the government to choose carbon capture and storage with coal on more facilities then prices will go up substantially more.

Hydro Quebec has done a study comparing prices across North America.
http://www.hydroquebec.com/data/documents-donnees/pdf/comparison-electricity-prices.pdf

Our rates in Saskatchewan are only a little bit less expensive than Ontario large cities. I am not sure what rural residents pay in Ontario.

[furrowtickler]

Chuck and grass , I will ask again for the 4th time , how many of your units on farm are their 4 engines with complete DEF systems??? What are you doing in your farm do reduce emissions.
Most of us are not opposed to reducing emissions or forthat matter any pollution that we can . But I am sure those that bark the loudest are doing nothing speacial themselves .
This carbon tax is simply a wealth transfer scheme no matter how you dress it up .
A carbon tax will do nothing for climate change but force almost all of us out of business.
Wearealready payi g dearly for emissions controls and a carbon tax will not save one fukin penguin or polar bear orchange the climate.... ever .

[chuckChuck]

And the double standard for scientific evidence shines through yet again. Anecdotal evidence of incremental improvements in existing Lithium battery technology isn't the sustainable breakthrough that will be required to make the system viable, economically or environmentally.

I've got the newest Milwaukee big 1/2" impact, and the batteries are amazing, but cheap they are not, do the math on how many of those it will take to power your farm for the winter, and let us know how economical that is.

One more piece of anecdotal evidence that battery costs are not affordable for large scales. The resident troll did not install energy storage to go along with the solar panels, instead relying on the existing (primarily fossil fuel) energy grid for storage. Explain how cost wasn't a factor in that decision.

I'll offer more anecdotal evidence in return. Who here has a smart phone with more than a years use that can survive a full day on one charge?

Bloomberg predicts battery cost will come away down. They already have. There are so many battery powered options for consumers now it has been a rapid change. Built in obsolescence may be a factor in battery life. They may not be particularly cheap now but the future is a long time. 20-30 years ago we had bugger all for battery powered tools now we use them everyday and cost is not much of a factor.

My smart phone is at least 2-3 years old and lasts all day that I need it. It doesn't like to get cold though. Samsung batteries apparently last better in the cold.

There are other renewable storage options being developed and deployed besides batteries. You can bet that engineers are working hard to develop all kinds of new technology that will allow renewable energy to be stored.

You are correct, currently batteries are too expensive for my load requirements. But that doesn't mean it will always be that way.

[chuckChuck]

Chuck and grass , I will ask again for the 4th time , how many of your units on farm are their 4 engines with complete DEF systems??? What are you doing in your farm do reduce emissions.
Most of us are not opposed to reducing emissions or forthat matter any pollution that we can . But I am sure those that bark the loudest are doing nothing speacial themselves .
This carbon tax is simply a wealth transfer scheme no matter how you dress it up .
A carbon tax will do nothing for climate change but force almost all of us out of business.
Wearealready payi g dearly for emissions controls and a carbon tax will not save one fukin penguin or polar bear orchange the climate.... ever .

I have energy efficient buildings, furnaces,boilers. I have a solar system in the works to cover my average electricity usage. I don't have any tier 4 engines with DEF as I run a mix of tractors with just a few newer pieces with diesel particulate filters. But we try to reduce energy usage as much possible.
The biggest single energy input in crop agriculture is Nitrogen fertilizer. Unless you are using animal manure or growing a lot of legumes.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Much like the entire CAGW prophecies, always about what will happen, batteries will get cheap enough someday. And much like CAGW, the goalposts keep getting moved as milestone after milestone gets missed by miles.

[Guest]

I have energy efficient buildings, furnaces,boilers. I have a solar system in the works to cover my average electricity usage. I don't have any tier 4 engines with DEF as I run a mix of tractors with just a few newer pieces with diesel particulate filters. But we try to reduce energy usage as much possible.
The biggest single energy input in crop agriculture is Nitrogen fertilizer. Unless you are using animal manure or growing a lot of legumes.

“I try to reduce usage as much as possible”

Well the tree huggers that dont even know what glyphos is are gonna **** that up real soon for us
It’ll be cultivators goin everywhere , 3 times as much fuel used , and soil blowin all over the prairies
What a bunch of idiots
Glyphos probably done more for the environment than anyone can imagine
Our land is ten times better than in the “dirty eighties”
Had a 1/4 blow away back then . not very nice. Took a lot of years and lots of alfalfa to get it productive again
One good thing , it’ll take care of the “percieved” grain glut

[fjlip]

Everyone with a BRAIN reduces costs/usage. We are totally insulated to the MAX. Vehicles all efficient, Machinery all tuned. Proper chem use and Min till. There is no reason to beat up ag! This shit is all expensive! So give us carrots(credits) if reducing NOT a stick (Carbon Tax) to beat us into bankruptcy! Total idiots!

[chuckChuck]

Agriculture has a case for exemptions or rebates of the carbon tax if the impact is significant.

Aren't most provinces planning on exempting agricultural fuels?

But lets see the numbers and impact potential. I think in many cases the impacts are exaggerated.

The problem is some believe human caused climate change is not happening and that we should not do anything. Hiding from the consequences won't make them go away.

[Guest]

Again how in **** will a carbon tax influence the way you farm other than your bottom line

[MBgrower]

How will farmers recoup the carbon taxes imposed on them? Diesel, freight, chemicals, parts, grain shipping, fertilizer, increased equipment costs, almost everthing a farmer does will be taxed. Do you think they will send you a cheque, hahahaha. Not funny!!!! This could actually make farming unsustainable!!!!

we could all rent and buy more land to spread our costs out even more.

[BreadWinner]

Putting a carbon tax on farms may actually create a opposite effect on carbon output on the farm. We won't be able to afford more efficient machinery, soil testing will be cut out of our budget so we may be over fertilizing in areas, we will burn more stubble instead of incorporating it into the soil, etc.