Renewables Chuck

[oneoff]

It is a fact that when starting from scratch or near zero output;...it is very easy to show some remarkable and astronomical increases.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

It is a fact that when starting from scratch or near zero output;...it is very easy to show some remarkable and astronomical increases.

Which leads to one of the math tricks these folks like to play on the mathematically ignorant. With claims such as fastest growing etc. If I put my hamster on a wheel with a generator, I just grew hampster power by infinity percent in one year, if I add another next year, 100% growth yoy.

[chuckChuck]

How many times do I have to repeat that Saskpower is on track to have 50% renewables by 2030?

We will still be dependent on fossil energy after 2030, but your arguments that renewables such as wind and solar have no place in Saskatchewan is totally wrong as proven by Sask powers plans!

You have lost this argument, give up!

Renewables are here, they are currently operating and Saskpower is planning more.

Call up Saskpower and tell them they are wrong!

You can argue black is white and white is black.... Saskpower doesn't care.

They will tell you to bugger off with your negative, uninformed views. LMAO

[oneoff]

For the umpteenth time

You can make anything fly by putting enough horse power behind it.

But not much sense asking for questions to be answered if it would potentially cause confusion in anyone's mind concerning

"what you know you already know"

[AlbertaFarmer5]

For the umpteenth time

You can make anything fly by putting enough horse power behind it.

Which is another way of saying enough government subsidies, and enough mandate to pass on bloated and unnecessary costs to the end user.

Just because something is built due to misguided policy, usually by crony capitalists, doesn't automatically make it economical, viable, or sustainable. Canada is littered with examples.

I could seed the entire farm to pineapples next year, and by your logic, that automatically means that they will grow successfully, and profitably.

[oneoff]

Here are a couple of peak electricity usage numbers from 2017. They have probably been surpassed by now but they indicate peak summer demand is not far behind peak winter demand.

July 10th, 2017 - 3419 Mw
Jan 13, 2017 - 3747 Mw

“The winter peak record is still higher at 3,747 MW, but year-over-year we’re seeing the summer peak close the gap,” Kory Hayko, SaskPower’s vice-president of transmission and industrial services, said in a release.

I presume this is somehow meant to show the value of solar industry during the summer months in which solar panel output is typically higher.

The more important message is that at all times during the year; solar can be seen as an undependable intruder into a grid system that could never be counted on for any output at all during any night (on a province wide basis); and highly variable output the rest of the time compared to any other traditional electrical generation.

What is missing is the storage component. ie. functional and anything but cheap batteries or another method not currently "off the shelf" to provide continuous power on its own merits.

When and if those solar panels (and the necessary "accessories") get worked into the financial statement; the real cost of solar in the future can be compared apples to apples with what we now have.

[oneoff]

In summary; the 15% or 16% expected electrical output (compared to the 10Kw or whatever name plate rating)....can be stated in another way that any rational person should be able to agree with.

UNDER REAL SASK CONDITIONS; SOLAR PANELS DON'T PRODUCE POWER (OR THAT WHICH AMOUNTS TO MUCH) AT LEAST 80% OF THE TIME.
ITS TO BAD THAT THE GRANTS WERE AT LEAST BASED ON WHAT THE SOLAR SYSTEM WAS GOOD FOR...RATHER THAN 6 TIMES THAT FIGURE.

Just another way of inflating significance, I suppose.

[chuckChuck]

Nobody is arguing that solar is currently going to replace hydro or fossil sources of electricity without some sort of storage system. But we already know that engineers are working on storage systems to make renewable forms of electricity much more usable. Read about the MIT research on batteries.

If a 25 kw system produces 35000 kwh in a year and that 35000 kwh is not produced by coal then there are obvious benefits to solar in cleaner air and lower carbon emissions.

Even without a subsidy, solar panels are going to produce electricity at a lower cost than what Saskpower charges for a kwh. Solar panels keep getting more efficient and cheaper and electricity from Saskpower keeps rising in price. So how can this be a bad deal?

So based on the fact that solar systems are already affordable, can pay for themselves and produce lower cost cleaner electricity from a free source of fuel, why are you so opposed to individual, farmers and utilities investing in solar PV systems?

In short, there is a good business case for farms on the southern prairies to invest in Solar PV.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Nobody is arguing that solar is currently going to replace hydro or fossil sources of electricity without some sort of storage system. But we already know that engineers are working on storage systems to make renewable forms of electricity much more usable. Read about the MIT research on batteries.

If a 25 kw system produces 35000 kwh in a year and that 35000 kwh is not produced by coal then there are obvious benefits to solar in cleaner air and lower carbon emissions.

Even without a subsidy, solar panels are going to produce electricity at a lower cost than what Saskpower charges for a kwh. Solar panels keep getting more efficient and cheaper and electricity from Saskpower keeps rising in price. So how can this be a bad deal?

So based on the fact that solar systems are already affordable, can pay for themselves and produce lower cost cleaner electricity from a free source of fuel, why are you so opposed to individual, farmers and utilities investing in solar PV systems?

In short, there is a good business case for farms on the southern prairies to invest in Solar PV.

I ask once again, why would electricity continue to rise in price if solar is making it cheaper and is being installed in significant quantities going forward?

Personally, I am all for farmers and individuals installing solar or any other alternative generation system with their own funds. Utilities is another story. Current regulations of power generators actually encourages non-economic choices since they are permitted to raise their rates to cover the additional costs. If they can do it without subsidies and without raising rates to cover the costs, then I am all for that as well.

[chuckChuck]

"I ask once again, why would electricity continue to rise in price if solar is making it cheaper and is being installed in significant quantities going forward?"

According to Wikipedia if it is accurate, Saskpower has 4437 MW of available generating capacity most of it owned some of it purchased. Of that total, 212 MW are from wind or less than 5%. There would be a very small amount of solar PV under their net metering program and other solar programs.

Two of Saskpowers big projects were the $1.5 Billion invested in Carbon Capture and Storage at Boundary and an ongoing investment of $680 million in the 350 MW Chinook natural gas facility due to come on line in 2019.

Saskpower serves a very small population with over 500,000 customers over a very large distribution system with ongoing maintenance and upgrades. Generation is only part of their costs.

There is no case to be made that their investments from 2005 to 2018 which saw a 60% increase in farm rates had anything to do with investments in wind or solar.

If you have further questions contact Sask power or The Sakatchewan Rate Review Panel which over sees rate increases.

http://www.saskratereview.ca/index.php
"The Saskatchewan Rate Review Panel advises the Government of Saskatchewan on rate applications proposed by SaskEnergy, SaskPower and the SGI Auto Fund. The Panel reviews each application and provides an independent public report stating its opinion about the fairness and reasonableness of the rate change, while balancing the interests of the customer, the Crown corporation and the public."