Seed Synergy... what does our Canadian seed system.. need to do?

[farmaholic]

How much do you sell certified seed for Tom?

I realize there are extra production costs, lay it all out for us to see, "justify" it for us.

Side note to Bucket... as End use customers enjoy part of the 11 to 1 multiplier ROI... perhaps it is only fair... commercial grain buyers... and end use consumers... Directly pay some % into cereal seed R&D themselves. Cheers

[blackjack]

Total bs Tom one being a rancher the end user has always lowered their bid to ensure the profit.It would be the same in the grain industry who are you kidding.

[TOM4CWB]

Farmaholic,
As often 50% or more of our certified seed... is most sold/disposed of as commercial grain;
As we work co-operatively on a % share of seed sales our co-op sells each year... our 'share margin' from farm seed revenues are most often average under 5% of commercial grain value on a composite basis projected over 10 years. Cheers

What do you sell your certified seed for?

[TOM4CWB]

Dear Bucket,
As rotations... and pedigreed seed land use [for purity quality control] protocol requires over 50% of our production acreage be harvested as commercial grain... there are no seed revenues from 3/4 of our grain production. Cheers

Tom4$4himself

You forgot to mention your markup on certified seed sales...usually 2 to 3 times market value of the best year....

Don't ****ing say seed growers don't make money....you have certified seed sales for all your work and then the common seed sales at higher prices as well....


I think if this tax is implemented then we should be paying market price for certified seed and the royalty can take care of the industry.....

[farmaholic]

Geez Tom, hardly seems worth the effort, I guess I'll have to take your word.

50% cert sold as commercial because seed quality can't be met? Picked the wrong variety, hence no one wants it? Asking too much(after royalties, cleaning and handling, certification and inspection costs are all accounted for)?

I can honestly say I don't understand the "co-op" marketing thing....are you wholesaling it to a "Co-op" retailer or are you talking the Secan Co-operative dividend type payment.

Thanks in advance.

Farmaholic,
As often 50% or more of our certified seed... is most sold/disposed of as commercial grain;
As we work co-operatively on a % share of seed sales our co-op sells each year... our 'share margin' from farm seed revenues are most often average under 5% of commercial grain value on a composite basis projected over 10 years. Cheers

[farmaholic]

Is it not possible to diversify and extend rotations so more crops qualify for the certified category?

Thanks in advance again.

Dear Bucket,
As rotations... and pedigreed seed land use [for purity quality control] protocol requires over 50% of our production acreage be harvested as commercial grain... there are no seed revenues from 3/4 of our grain production. Cheers

[bucket]

Geez Tom, hardly seems worth the effort, I guess I'll have to take your word.

50% cert sold as commercial because seed quality can't be met? Picked the wrong variety, hence no one wants it? Asking too much(after royalties, cleaning and handling, certification and inspection costs are all accounted for)?

I can honestly say I don't understand the "co-op" marketing thing....are you wholesaling it to a "Co-op" retailer or are you talking the Secan Co-operative dividend type payment.

Thanks in advance.

Another TOM4JUSTME sympathy story....don't fall for it....

[wmoebis]

Dear Bucket,
As rotations... and pedigreed seed land use [for purity quality control] protocol requires over 50% of our production acreage be harvested as commercial grain... there are no seed revenues from 3/4 of our grain production. Cheers

Does that explain how Triffid flax got into the system and contaminated flax industry?

[furrowtickler]

Regardless of all the hardships in the seed industry from the breeder to the seed grower ....... the end result will be as an example ...
2000 ac wheat seed cost from $14 / ac to $35 .

That’s an extra $42,000 cost for an average grower with 2000 ac of wheat .
It does not matter how Tom splits that out into seed growers , breeders or the many other leach’s in between, that money is still going to come out of primary producers pockets . And the numbers will be at least that . No different than what happened in the canola seed Industry. It exploded from $2/lb to $15 in a relatively short time .
I am not here to bash seed growers at all , I am just stating that guys like Tom refuse to admit that this is going to cost primary producers a lot of money . He just spent the past 2 weeks making every excuse known in The industry to deflect attention to the fact stated above .
That’s the aggravation of it all ..
no different than the supporters of the carbon tax ...... just admit that it’s going to cost us all a lot of money we don’t have .
Growing more bushels to cover these costs is getting us nowhere but every one else in the Ag industry more money .
Then throw in Mother Nature in where we are at complete mercy of in terms yields ... not fancy seed , fertilizers or any other input or extra wealth transfer costs .
That is why most of us are saying ... enough already !!

[TOM4CWB]

Wmoebis,
It cannot be absolutely proved... BUT
Triffid contamination appears to have been magnified through plant breeding stocks... after being contaminated with the triffid genetics at the top levels... then spread through the breeder seed/pedigreed seed system ... with contamination very difficult to identify...
years of reproduction went by[perhaps over 10 years]...
Then it was very difficult and costly to completely rebuild seed varieties and stocks from the top down.

Does that explain how Triffid flax got into the system and contaminated flax industry?

[TOM4CWB]

Furrowtickler,
Our farm pedigreed seed production... is a matter of heritage... not profit based. As A CSGA member for 40 years... producing high quality planting seed is a matter of farm practice... not driven by profit. If 25% of our pedigreed seed production is not seeded as planting seed... it normally is not because of purity... we will not pedigree a crop that is impure... or of poor germination. Lack of demand for a variety... is the normal reason pedigreed seed is dumped as commercial grain... we are required to forecast demand often 2-3 years before planting seed sales... which is often harder for us to figure out before real seed demand actually is a market reality. Easier for Commercial growers to identify real increased value of a variety... after it has been tested through the pedigreed seed multiplication phase of introduction to grain farmers.

Regardless of all the hardships in the seed industry from the breeder to the seed grower ....... the end result will be as an example ...
2000 ac wheat seed cost from $14 / ac to $35 .

That’s an extra $42,000 cost for an average grower with 2000 ac of wheat .
It does not matter how Tom splits that out into seed growers , breeders or the many other leach’s in between, that money is still going to come out of primary producers pockets . And the numbers will be at least that . No different than what happened in the canola seed Industry. It exploded from $2/lb to $15 in a relatively short time .
I am not here to bash seed growers at all , I am just stating that guys like Tom refuse to admit that this is going to cost primary producers a lot of money . He just spent the past 2 weeks making every excuse known in The industry to deflect attention to the fact stated above .
That’s the aggravation of it all ..
no different than the supporters of the carbon tax ...... just admit that it’s going to cost us all a lot of money we don’t have .
Growing more bushels to cover these costs is getting us nowhere but every one else in the Ag industry more money .
Then throw in Mother Nature in where we are at complete mercy of in terms yields ... not fancy seed , fertilizers or any other input or extra wealth transfer costs .
That is why most of us are saying ... enough already !!

[blackpowder]

Tom couldn't say poop if his mouth was full. But I can.
Getting into seed myself on the pulse side. It's not a mortgage lifter.
Seed growers aren't the enemy just the messenger.
$40/ac for wheat seed won't go far unless it's bred for something very special.