Calgary Herald-AB government ——-> Solar Energy Contract - Truth or Fiction?

[sumdumguy]

Energy for 4.8 cents/ kwh for 20 year contract - fact or fiction. It’s a solar farm south of Calgary, set up to replace(much more expensive) expiring wind power contracts. This is earth-shattering news if it legit.

[Robertbarlage]

Fiction.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Energy for 4.8 cents/ kwh for 20 year contract - fact or fiction. It’s a solar farm south of Calgary, set up to replace(much more expensive) expiring wind power contracts. This is earth-shattering news if it legit.

I want it to be true. I expect the details are in the fine print. Probably has something to do with installed capacity vs. actual generation, and I will personally guarantee that that cost does not include storage, or upgrades to the infrastructure to keep it stable while adding that much unreliable. We are in election mode, so an announcement such as this is pure electioneering, which doesn't make it false automatically.

Southern Alberta is the best location in the country for solar power, if it can be economic anywhere, it is that area.

[dmlfarmer]

I want it to be true. I expect the details are in the fine print. Probably has something to do with installed capacity vs. actual generation, and I will personally guarantee that that cost does not include storage, or upgrades to the infrastructure to keep it stable while adding that much unreliable. We are in election mode, so an announcement such as this is pure electioneering, which doesn't make it false automatically.

Southern Alberta is the best location in the country for solar power, if it can be economic anywhere, it is that area.

Saudi Arabia, Chile, and Mexico have solar power installation contracts for between 2 and 3 cents/kwh.
Now Nevada Power has accepted 6 contracts for solar generation for under 3 cents/kwh with the lowest contract at 2.155 cents.

Oh, and AF5, you might want to reconsider your personal guarantee seeing 3 of the Nevada Power contracts at under 3 cents include storage capacity.

https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/14/new-us-solar-record-2-155-cents-per-kwh-400-mwh-of-energy-storage/ https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/14/new-us-solar-record-2-155-cents-per-kwh-400-mwh-of-energy-storage/

https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/11/new-ppa-in-arizona-locks-in-lowest-solar-prices-in-us-as-demise-of-navajo-station-looms/ https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/11/new-ppa-in-arizona-locks-in-lowest-solar-prices-in-us-as-demise-of-navajo-station-looms/

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Saudi Arabia, Chile, and Mexico have solar power installation contracts for between 2 and 3 cents/kwh.
Now Nevada Power has accepted 6 contracts for solar generation for under 3 cents/kwh with the lowest contract at 2.155 cents.

Oh, and AF5, you might want to reconsider your personal guarantee seeing 3 of the Nevada Power contracts at under 3 cents include storage capacity.

https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/14/new-us-solar-record-2-155-cents-per-kwh-400-mwh-of-energy-storage/ https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/14/new-us-solar-record-2-155-cents-per-kwh-400-mwh-of-energy-storage/

https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/11/new-ppa-in-arizona-locks-in-lowest-solar-prices-in-us-as-demise-of-navajo-station-looms/ https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/11/new-ppa-in-arizona-locks-in-lowest-solar-prices-in-us-as-demise-of-navajo-station-looms/

As I said, I want it to be true, and when my power bills reflect those decreasing costs, I will believe it. Unfortunately, as Chuck seems unable to refute, power bills keep going up disproportionately in locations that install additional renewable energy. There are a lot of external costs involved in the remainder of the grid and in back up dispatchable sources that don't get included in those generation figures, which put together, NEVER yet lead to decreased costs to the consumer.

It will be interesting to see how the storage project in Nevada turns out. The article from July has this quote:

What is really interesting is that adding battery storage only increases those numbers between 0.5 and 0.8 cents per kWh

And Tesla is bidding at that. Given Tesla's track record, and doubtful future, I'm not convinced that their number is based on reality though.

Some numbers for reference:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelshellenberger/2018/04/25/yes-solar-and-wind-really-do-increase-electricity-prices-and-for-inherently-physical-reasons/#38ba1c7517e8 https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelshellenberger/2018/04/25/yes-solar-and-wind-really-do-increase-electricity-prices-and-for-inherently-physical-reasons/#38ba1c7517e8

[Robertbarlage]

Saudi Arabia is building 2 new nuclear power plants , were doing nothing .

[Guest]

Saudi Arabia is building 2 new nuclear power plants , were doing nothing .

And were buying their oil to help subsidize them

[dmlfarmer]

As I said, I want it to be true, and when my power bills reflect those decreasing costs, I will believe it....

AF5 I am not sure why you think consumer power rates simply reflect the cost of production and transmission and will only believe solar is competitive if your electricity bill goes down.

I really want to see cheaper gasoline at the pumps given it is as much as it was when a barrel of oil was double what it is now.
I really want to see cheaper N seeing as we produce more than we use in Canada and export N yet the price I pay is not based on cost of production here but is based on Black Sea prices plus freight to get it to Canada.
I understand the consumer price of electricity tripled in Alberta since it was privatized. Yet privatization did not increase the cost of the actual production costs of Alberta coal fired power plants or hydro electric generation or transmission of electricity. Shades of Enron?
And my cost or even the cost of production of all Canadian farmers or the has little to no impact on the price offered for farm commodities as much as we want it to.

If a solar producer is willing to contract X amount of MWH of production for 4.8 cents in Alberta, that is a reflection of what his solar power production costs are; including equipment, risk, and profit. But it will have very little bearing on what the consumer ends up paying due to the electricity market, even after privatization, is not a free and truly competitive marketplace.