Fjlip wrote:
"Trudeau put a carbon tarrif on everything and for no reason and then he charged GST on the tax. Talk about that dml. Dare you "
Bucket wrote: "Don't worry about DML talking about it...Why isn't Scheer getting media time on it...thats a bit of a worry that Scheer isn't...."
on another tread and I do not want to change the topic on that thread so I will respond here.
I do not like the carbon tax either. It will cost me money. However, the Liberals clearly campaigned and were elected on a platform promised action on climate change. Most Canadians still believe climate change is a problem and want governments to do something about climate change. The Liberal plan, by putting a price on carbon, is a proven method of reducing consumption by higher cost of carbon. Yes, if consumption is not or in the case of farming cannot be reduced, the costs of all products and services derived from that consumption increase . That is where the proceeds of the carbon tax should have gone. Payments for people dependant on carbon that cannot reduce consumption - like farmers. And the Liberals have done a terrible job in making the tax revenue neutral and for that reason it should be scrapped until the details are worked out. Exactly the same with the lack of transparency that happened after the ending of the wheat board. In both cases the intent was good but incomplete and no follow-up to address the problems.
Second. The Conservative climate change targets are exactly the same as the Liberals. However instead of a visible carbon tax, they are going to penalize large emitters. Do you honestly believe that those large emitters that suddenly have massive bills for emissions are not going to increase their costs to their consumers and those costs will not be passed on down the line exactly the same way the carbon tax is? The conservative climate change plan also calls for providing incentives for climate change friendly actions. Tell me, who is going to take advantage of those incentives that can be earned if they spend money improving homes and businesses.... the young people with debt and mortgages or persons and businesses with spare cash to burn already? And everyone that pays taxes will be paying for those incentives yet it the richest who can earn the most of them. Another government plan for taxing everyone for the benefit of a few.
Cry all you want about the Liberal carbon tax, but I prefer that to a hidden taxes that the Conservatives plan to implement. I just demand the Liberals rebate the tax to those who cannot afford it, starting with farmers.
Third, posters on here cry about the carbon tax making them uncompetitive and putting them out of business. Look at charts of gas prices over the last ten years and I dare you to count the number of times gas has increased by more than 5 cents a litre, yet farmers are still around. And businesses passed on those higher energy prices just as they pass on the carbon tax. Even more interesting, I am willing to bet by shopping around you can find a 5 cent a litre difference on any day between fuel suppliers. So if 5 cent carbon tax is the straw that breaks the camels back, why hasn't the volatile fuel costs done that years ago?
Farmers are not going to change the opinion of governments (Liberal Conservative or any other) or the public by crying about and denying climate change. My entire argument is and has always been instead of fighting an unwinnable battle against climate change we need to focus on getting agriculture recognized as an industry that already does more than its share of fighting climate change and farmers must be rewarded financially for the work they are already doing in fighting climate change. We are giving away a product (sequestration of greenhouse gasses) on every field and farm yet the Saskatchewan government is giving billions to corporate sector to bury them. We must be demanding payment for what we are doing. This Bucket, is where government support for farms could come from without subsidization questions being raised by our trading partners, or negative connotations from taxpayers. Farmers would simply be paid for a product they are delivering. Why are we not demanding that of our politicians before the election? Oh I know, we would sooner deny climate change than sell a solution the public and governments both demand.
"Trudeau put a carbon tarrif on everything and for no reason and then he charged GST on the tax. Talk about that dml. Dare you "
Bucket wrote: "Don't worry about DML talking about it...Why isn't Scheer getting media time on it...thats a bit of a worry that Scheer isn't...."
on another tread and I do not want to change the topic on that thread so I will respond here.
I do not like the carbon tax either. It will cost me money. However, the Liberals clearly campaigned and were elected on a platform promised action on climate change. Most Canadians still believe climate change is a problem and want governments to do something about climate change. The Liberal plan, by putting a price on carbon, is a proven method of reducing consumption by higher cost of carbon. Yes, if consumption is not or in the case of farming cannot be reduced, the costs of all products and services derived from that consumption increase . That is where the proceeds of the carbon tax should have gone. Payments for people dependant on carbon that cannot reduce consumption - like farmers. And the Liberals have done a terrible job in making the tax revenue neutral and for that reason it should be scrapped until the details are worked out. Exactly the same with the lack of transparency that happened after the ending of the wheat board. In both cases the intent was good but incomplete and no follow-up to address the problems.
Second. The Conservative climate change targets are exactly the same as the Liberals. However instead of a visible carbon tax, they are going to penalize large emitters. Do you honestly believe that those large emitters that suddenly have massive bills for emissions are not going to increase their costs to their consumers and those costs will not be passed on down the line exactly the same way the carbon tax is? The conservative climate change plan also calls for providing incentives for climate change friendly actions. Tell me, who is going to take advantage of those incentives that can be earned if they spend money improving homes and businesses.... the young people with debt and mortgages or persons and businesses with spare cash to burn already? And everyone that pays taxes will be paying for those incentives yet it the richest who can earn the most of them. Another government plan for taxing everyone for the benefit of a few.
Cry all you want about the Liberal carbon tax, but I prefer that to a hidden taxes that the Conservatives plan to implement. I just demand the Liberals rebate the tax to those who cannot afford it, starting with farmers.
Third, posters on here cry about the carbon tax making them uncompetitive and putting them out of business. Look at charts of gas prices over the last ten years and I dare you to count the number of times gas has increased by more than 5 cents a litre, yet farmers are still around. And businesses passed on those higher energy prices just as they pass on the carbon tax. Even more interesting, I am willing to bet by shopping around you can find a 5 cent a litre difference on any day between fuel suppliers. So if 5 cent carbon tax is the straw that breaks the camels back, why hasn't the volatile fuel costs done that years ago?
Farmers are not going to change the opinion of governments (Liberal Conservative or any other) or the public by crying about and denying climate change. My entire argument is and has always been instead of fighting an unwinnable battle against climate change we need to focus on getting agriculture recognized as an industry that already does more than its share of fighting climate change and farmers must be rewarded financially for the work they are already doing in fighting climate change. We are giving away a product (sequestration of greenhouse gasses) on every field and farm yet the Saskatchewan government is giving billions to corporate sector to bury them. We must be demanding payment for what we are doing. This Bucket, is where government support for farms could come from without subsidization questions being raised by our trading partners, or negative connotations from taxpayers. Farmers would simply be paid for a product they are delivering. Why are we not demanding that of our politicians before the election? Oh I know, we would sooner deny climate change than sell a solution the public and governments both demand.
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