Windfarm Blocked

[AlbertaFarmer5]

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/15/business/china-solar-electricity-scli-intl/index.html

Solar power is now cheaper than the grid in hundreds of Chinese cities

London (CNN Business)Solar energy in hundreds of Chinese cities is now cheaper than electricity supplied by the national grid, and it can even compete with coal-fired power in 75 of them, a new study has found.
Some 344 Chinese cities were found to have solar systems producing energy at lower prices than the grid, without any subsidies, according to the research published in the journal Nature Energy. That could encourage further investment in renewable energy, according to the authors.
China has made huge progress in developing solar projects and pledged to invest 2.5 trillion yuan ($367 billion) in renewable power generation — solar, wind, hydro and nuclear — from 2017-2020.

Thanks for the research Chuck, I wanted to read the paper, sounds promising. But unfortunately it is behind a paywall. Are you subscribed, have you read it, care to share the details?

The abstract has a few minor words that differ from the media articles though:

We reveal that all of these cities can achieve—without subsidies—solar PV electricity prices lower than grid-supplied prices, and around 22% of the cities’ solar generation electricity prices can compete with desulfurized coal benchmark electricity prices.

"Can achieve" indicates that this is theoretical, not yet in practice. More models, not measured results. Interesting how the media replaced the future tense with the present tense "now". And they are comparing to Desulferized coal plants( a good thing considering the pollution issues they face), I tried to find out what percent of Chinese coal plants currently utilize SO2 scrubbers, but haven't found the answer yet. Not clear if that is a fair comparison or not.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/small-biz/productline/power-generation/how-india-in-a-short-period-of-time-has-become-the-cheapest-producer-of-solar-power/articleshow/70325301.cms?from=mdr

How India in a short period of time has become the cheapest producer of solar power

India’s solar story through its compelling business case is maximizing the falling renewable technology costs as the key to future energy decarbonisation. The country has realised that it is cheaper to build and operate solar farms than to run existing coal-fired power plants. Renewable energy also has significant environment benefits making it the single biggest driver to help us meet our carbon emission reduction targets in our fight against climate change. With India being a growing economy, ..

That darned Media Chuck, once again they have changed a few inconsequential sounding words, and completely changed the meaning. I haven't read the IRENA report referenced in the article you posted, but on the way there I did find this regarding the IRENA report:

The IRENA report sees falling renewable technology costs as key to future energy decarbonisation, noting it will ultimately be cheaper to build and operate solar and wind farms than to run existing coal-fired power plants.

Once again, future tense, speculation, likely based on more models. Why does the media keep doing this Chuck? Almost looks deliberate, doesn't it? Probably safe to assume that most readers will take the present tense at face value, and never dig any deeper, then spread that on social media.

Link to the IRENA report, if you have time for some light reading, I will try to get to it later:

https://www.irena.org/-/media/Files/IRENA/Agency/Publication/2019/May/IRENA_Renewable-Power-Generations-Costs-in-2018.pdf?la=en&hash=99683CDDBC40A729A5F51C20DA7B6C 297F794C5D https://www.irena.org/-/media/Files/IRENA/Agency/Publication/2019/May/IRENA_Renewable-Power-Generations-Costs-in-2018.pdf?la=en&hash=99683CDDBC40A729A5F51C20DA7B6C 297F794C5D

[burnt]

Models...did someone says "models"?

Well how'bow'da - JBP also mentions "models".

Warning: This video contains some positive information which may actually bring comfort to some readers.

[jazz]

Models...did someone says "models"?

Well how'bow'da - JBP also mentions "models".

Chuck will be on in the morning to tell you Dr Peterson is not a scientist and we should actually be listening to Bill Nye.

[fjlip]

Or Al Gore, or Leonardo or GRETA the abused, or NOAA, or CBC, or EC deleted data replaced with "MODELS" of what should be...because all other stuff is deniers or paid for by OIL, or Republicans or Rednecks or Alt Right or Conservatives....

[chuckChuck]

https://www.irena.org/-/media/Files/IRENA/Agency/Publication/2019/May/IRENA_Renewable-Power-Generations-Costs-in-2018.pdf?la=en&hash=99683CDDBC40A729A5F51C20DA7B6C 297F794C5D https://www.irena.org/-/media/Files/IRENA/Agency/Publication/2019/May/IRENA_Renewable-Power-Generations-Costs-in-2018.pdf?la=en&hash=99683CDDBC40A729A5F51C20DA7B6C 297F794C5D

Key Findings

"In most parts of the world today, renewables have become the lowest-cost source of new power generation. As costs continue to fall for solar and wind technologies, this will be true in a growing number of countries"

"Onshore wind and solar PV are set by 2020 to consistently offer a less expensive source of new electricity than the least-cost fossil fuel alternative, without financial assistance. Among projects due to be commissioned in 2020, 77% of the onshore wind and 83% of the utility-scale solar PV project capacity in the IRENA Auction and PPA Database have electricity prices that are lower than the cheapest fossil fuel-fired power generation option for new generation"

"New solar PV and onshore wind are expected to increasingly cost less than the marginal operating cost of existing coal fired power plants."

"Very low, and falling, costs of electricity for solar PV and onshore wind, as well as cost reductions for CSP and offshore wind until 2020 and beyond, make renewable power the competitive backbone of the global energy sector transformation."

[jazz]

So payback on renewables has dropped from 20 yrs to 19.5 yrs, yay will get right on that one. Still a job for govts and virtue signalling fools. And if electricity is going to fall in price along with this new technology, the payback will remain out of reach.

But hey economics you know, not a strong suit of the non productive class.

[chuckChuck]

"The global weighted-average cost of electricity from all commercially available renewable power generation technologies declined in 2018. The cost of electricity from CSP declined 26% year-on-year in 2018, followed by bioenergy (-14%), solar PV and onshore wind, both declined by 13%, hydropower (-11%), geothermal and offshore (-1%). Individual bioenergy, hydropower, onshore wind and solar PV projects now commonly undercut fossil fuel-fired power generation, without financial assistance."

https://www.irena.org/-/media/Files/IRENA/Agency/Publication/2019/May/IRENA_Renewable-Power-Generations-Costs-in-2018.pdf?la=en&hash=99683CDDBC40A729A5F51C20DA7B6C 297F794C5D https://www.irena.org/-/media/Files/IRENA/Agency/Publication/2019/May/IRENA_Renewable-Power-Generations-Costs-in-2018.pdf?la=en&hash=99683CDDBC40A729A5F51C20DA7B6C 297F794C5D

[TASFarms]

https://www.irena.org/-/media/Files/IRENA/Agency/Publication/2019/May/IRENA_Renewable-Power-Generations-Costs-in-2018.pdf?la=en&hash=99683CDDBC40A729A5F51C20DA7B6C 297F794C5D https://www.irena.org/-/media/Files/IRENA/Agency/Publication/2019/May/IRENA_Renewable-Power-Generations-Costs-in-2018.pdf?la=en&hash=99683CDDBC40A729A5F51C20DA7B6C 297F794C5D

Key Findings

"In most parts of the world today, renewables have become the lowest-cost source of new power generation. As costs continue to fall for solar and wind technologies, this will be true in a growing number of countries"

"Onshore wind and solar PV are set by 2020 to consistently offer a less expensive source of new electricity than the least-cost fossil fuel alternative, without financial assistance. Among projects due to be commissioned in 2020, 77% of the onshore wind and 83% of the utility-scale solar PV project capacity in the IRENA Auction and PPA Database have electricity prices that are lower than the cheapest fossil fuel-fired power generation option for new generation"

"New solar PV and onshore wind are expected to increasingly cost less than the marginal operating cost of existing coal fired power plants."

"Very low, and falling, costs of electricity for solar PV and onshore wind, as well as cost reductions for CSP and offshore wind until 2020 and beyond, make renewable power the competitive backbone of the global energy sector transformation."

That’s complete garbage. Who is paying you to post this crap? You didn’t watch the Peterson clip? We all know you still need full capacity power back up for renewables,

[AlbertaFarmer5]

So, the same question as always Chuck, why does this cheap energy source never result in lower costs to the end user? If it is so much cheaper to produce, Ontario, Texas, California, Australia, UK, Germany etc. should be enjoying falling relative energy prices by now. Instead they (and every other area I've seem numbers for) are all rising much faster than average, and the only successes you can find are still in the future tense.

It would be really interesting to read the paper on China and find out the details. Do they have the same expectations as us, reliable electricity 24/7, or are they off the grid, and limiting their electricity consumption to daylight hours? The article said nothing of storage costs to achieve the lower overall costs.

[chuckChuck]

Hey A5 you said renewables raised the price everywhere! Not in China!

Solar power is now cheaper than the grid in hundreds of Chinese cities

London (CNN Business)Solar energy in hundreds of Chinese cities is now cheaper than electricity supplied by the national grid, and it can even compete with coal-fired power in 75 of them, a new study has found.
Some 344 Chinese cities were found to have solar systems producing energy at lower prices than the grid, without any subsidies, according to the research published in the journal Nature Energy. That could encourage further investment in renewable energy, according to the authors.
China has made huge progress in developing solar projects and pledged to invest 2.5 trillion yuan ($367 billion) in renewable power generation — solar, wind, hydro and nuclear — from 2017-2020.

[chuckChuck]

That’s complete garbage. Who is paying you to post this crap? You didn’t watch the Peterson clip? We all know you still need full capacity power back up for renewables,

Jordan Bernt Peterson is a Canadian clinical psychologist and a professor of psychology at the University of Toronto.

Need I say more about his qualifications when it comes to climate science?

He is only slightly more qualified than the astrologist forecaster.