Why Aren’t more rms declaring ag disaster?

[farmaholic]

I absolutely hate where Ag is going. Every industry has figured out how to extract more dollars from you, data, "professional agronomy", new and creative ways to stroke your ego so you buy shit that is completely ridiculous. Farmers help them to no end to make it so. Give them all your data, let them figure out exactly how much they can charge you, then sit back and complain there is no money in farming.

It boggles my mind farmers are such sheep to let all that into their farms to take their money. Wake the fu_ck up!!! Farmers edge just struck a deal with credit unions to manage loans based on the ag data they collect. Soon you won't even have to file income tax, John deere can do it for you, or Trimble, or Climate. Don't you realize Climate is connected directly to Bayer? You're giving all your farming info to the guys you say are taking all your money - because you are telling them everything. EVERYTHING.

Then there is the ones that say "Well they have satellites they know what i'm doing anyway so i may as well give them all the rest". Newsflash, satellite data isn't accurate at all until you add the final puzzle piece - ground truthing over your canbus.

How can farmers not see this? It is a retailers dream come true and exactly what they have been looking for. Any other business would literally kill for that information and we go - here you are and a cheque for taking my data.

it's my job to make sure they impact my farm as little as possible and not be one of those "good" farmers, and that's why i'm hating ag more and more, farmers are so blind and naive to what's going on they are making that much harder all the time. Even when told, just a blank stare, then talk about how cool it is all their data can be in one place. You are literally swiping away what makes farming great every time you turn on the shiny screen or iPad connected to the internet any time it comes near wifi.

Old school farming was and still is profitable today. The current load of "additional services" not required for direct primary production are taking a bigger and bigger chunk of your dollar. It's done so well, you don't even see it.

Everyone read this, then read it again. And again and again!!!!

[bucket]

As I said in another thread farmers gave been nickeled and dimed out of close to one billion dollars. ...

Nickels and dimes....tweety is talking dollars....

Read his post again and correlate how farmers are being robbed ....with permission....

[SASKFARMER]

Tweety on the above you wrote I agree and that is the reason I mess up my in cab yields every year. 55 ft header and run a 36. Keeps them guessing.

But one company that brags it doesn’t sell info is not being truthful. Oh shit they all are. It being truthful.

[Guest]

Tweety on the above you wrote I agree and that is the reason I mess up my in cab yields every year. 55 ft header and run a 36. Keeps them guessing.

But one company that brags it doesn’t sell info is not being truthful. Oh shit they all are. It being truthful.

i wonder if they know anyways ?
one of our combines reads header width off of gps , if you cut a 2 foot strip , yield stays the same , doesn't matter what width you enter?
older one w/o gps , you can fool

[wd9]

I've given up talking to farmers about this stuff, it just pisses them off. Oh Tweety, you're a true a$$hole - but you truly understand what's going on. I'm sure you post what you do just to shake the slumber out.

Here we go. Go to this site: https://wigle.net/ https://wigle.net/ Now there are a few sites that do this, but zoom in on highways, cities what ever. What it tracks is current SSID (your network name) of your wifi network and keeps track of another very important number, the BSSID. That number is the MAC address of the device connected to the actual internet, be it your phone or your router. You can't even begin to image the possibilities you can do with this. And you think extracting data from that shiny combine is a challenge when you "change" the yield display?

Those Google map street view vehicles just happen to have sensitive receivers that while they drive around create a map of all the wifi networks along with the SSID and BSSID numbers. Add Alexa, Echo, Wink, Smart things..... on and on to your system listening carefully to all that goes on. Most apps on your phone sending data, especially during off hours at night - use wireshark to confirm - to millions of other vendors. Facebook, once every 3 seconds collects information. Don't use facebook? Doesn't matter, you still have a BSSID.

I find it extremely frustrating that farmers open their very personal and valuable farm data to many of the applications whose single purpose is to harvest very valuable data and price crop inputs. My prediction at the adoption rate we are going at it, within 3 to 5 years you probably won't even be able to buy crop inputs without some form of data system - at the very least it will be regional pricing. Farmaholic won't pay as much for products as Saskfarmer does since Sk has better crops. Share the risk programs, in order to work, need to know your farming operation better then you do. For farms integrated with digital ag services/Climate, they have all they need. All the canbus that's important is recorded. Every second of the very short time you are using your equipment, that puck that plugs in captures it all.

You agree to a privacy policy that's 600 legal worded pages long that you also agree to them changing at any time. Here's a summary. We will extract all your data and use it any way we want, sell it to anyone we want, and store it forever. Pretty simple. Oh sure, they use words like, give you a better experience, to provide products more focused for your operation, to innovate - when in reality not a new herbicide has come out in 30 years. It's about selling thru target marketing, programs and pricing. Just like facebook is doing.

It's probably already too late to stop this in farming, just like in our personal lives. It's too inconvenient to stop.

[bucket]

It is interesting...Tweety highlights some good points and if you read them the wrong way he seems like an asshole....the you read his next post and he has nailed the problem...

I don't know if he is bi-polar but i won't be as quick to judge and let the thread go to a discussion....


Maybe he is just playing devil's advocate to make us all think.....we need a little more thinking...

[Guest]

I've given up talking to farmers about this stuff, it just pisses them off. Oh Tweety, you're a true a$$hole - but you truly understand what's going on. I'm sure you post what you do just to shake the slumber out.

Here we go. Go to this site: https://wigle.net/ https://wigle.net/ Now there are a few sites that do this, but zoom in on highways, cities what ever. What it tracks is current SSID (your network name) of your wifi network and keeps track of another very important number, the BSSID. That number is the MAC address of the device connected to the actual internet, be it your phone or your router. You can't even begin to image the possibilities you can do with this. And you think extracting data from that shiny combine is a challenge when you "change" the yield display?

Those Google map street view vehicles just happen to have sensitive receivers that while they drive around create a map of all the wifi networks along with the SSID and BSSID numbers. Add Alexa, Echo, Wink, Smart things..... on and on to your system listening carefully to all that goes on. Most apps on your phone sending data, especially during off hours at night - use wireshark to confirm - to millions of other vendors. Facebook, once every 3 seconds collects information. Don't use facebook? Doesn't matter, you still have a BSSID.

I find it extremely frustrating that farmers open their very personal and valuable farm data to many of the applications whose single purpose is to harvest very valuable data and price crop inputs. My prediction at the adoption rate we are going at it, within 3 to 5 years you probably won't even be able to buy crop inputs without some form of data system - at the very least it will be regional pricing. Farmaholic won't pay as much for products as Saskfarmer does since Sk has better crops. Share the risk programs, in order to work, need to know your farming operation better then you do. For farms integrated with digital ag services/Climate, they have all they need. All the canbus that's important is recorded. Every second of the very short time you are using your equipment, that puck that plugs in captures it all.

You agree to a privacy policy that's 600 legal worded pages long that you also agree to them changing at any time. Here's a summary. We will extract all your data and use it any way we want, sell it to anyone we want, and store it forever. Pretty simple. Oh sure, they use words like, give you a better experience, to provide products more focused for your operation, to innovate - when in reality not a new herbicide has come out in 30 years. It's about selling thru target marketing, programs and pricing. Just like facebook is doing.

It's probably already too late to stop this in farming, just like in our personal lives. It's too inconvenient to stop.

My head hurts
Im too old for this

[AlbertaFarmer5]

There are people hurting in every industry. And its going to get much worse. There are also businesses and farms doing extremely well.

Whining on Agriville constantly isn't going to change your situation, so why not spend your focus and time coming up with cost saving solutions and post those. Do some good for a change. I dare you to read the last 2000 posts and find a single one that is creative and or a step forward in a new direction.

It's just blah blah blah my life is so hard, please Justin send me money because i didn't harvest the last 5%.

Actually, Grassfarmer started a much needed thread about potential solutions, only a few of us even read the report, or bothered to post. I tried to have a conversation about the solutions, but even the OP wouldn't discuss it, and no one else has contributed, so the thread died. I'd love to have a productive conversation about solutions, and intend to start a thread, but I have my suspicions that it will go no where, no one is looking for practical solutions( because any solution that would involve us staying competitive in the global market aren't very popular), they are just here to vent and blame someone else.

Not all of us come on here to whine, and I tend to agree with almost all of your posts, they are really refreshing compared to the usual whining while sitting on a tropical beach somewhere.

Link to grassfarmers thread: https://www.agriville.com/threads/39561-some-substantial-reading https://www.agriville.com/threads/39561-some-substantial-reading

[farmaholic]

Society is voluntarily carrying around the electronic chips they vehemently opposed to have surgically implanted against their will.

Ingenious! Addict them to the technology.

[MBgrower]

it looks like we now have to find a "DEF-delete" type of solution for these software systems sending our data to the mothership. maybe WD9 can come up with a 'YIELD-Delete' module that can send nonsense data back to JD, Fieldfiew, Agleader, etc.

[helmsdale]

Anyone else feel like the alleged...
-not a farmer
-input supplier
-govt paper shuffler
Who did an epic mic drop earlier today in this thread maybe should have given us the courtesy of asking whether we wanted the blue pill or the red pill like morpheus in the matrix?

Tweety, I commend you sir on putting those thoughts out there on this forum. We've wandered around the edges of those topics, but FEW are truly aware.

Honestly, I think it deserves its own thread, and bear with us, your input would be appreciated. I'll get it rolling, as you certainly got my head spinning while driving home from med hat after hauling my last load of this years wheat. Honestly, my thoughts went far and wide, and I'm struggling to bring them back home to find a "logical endpoint" that I can work with in planning for the future of this STO farm.

[the big wheel]

The only farms doing well are the ones that haven’t had major disasters over and over. The programs don’t work people lose everything and rhen yes Simone else backs dny oil companies foreign countries or input capital types take over which covers up the rhe shitshow that is happenning.
Our area 3 farmers are packing it in 120
Years and now done. 3 years of drought it’s over. People on the area that have had multi year perfect weather talk big until it hits them then it’s over.

[Goodtime]

The only farms doing well are the ones that haven’t had major disasters over and over. The programs don’t work people lose everything and rhen yes Simone else backs dny oil companies foreign countries or input capital types take over which covers up the rhe shitshow that is happenning.
Our area 3 farmers are packing it in 120
Years and now done. 3 years of drought it’s over. People on the area that have had multi year perfect weather talk big until it hits them then it’s over.

I couldn't agree more with your comments....but I guess I am one of the whiny ones according to an earlier poster.....a lot of guys are only 50% done in our area....and no I can honestly say that most of these guys aren't subscribing to Fieldview, Farmers Edge etc etc etc, just hard working farmers trying to make a go of it and this isn't the first shit year in this area. The odd fellow might have a Platinum edition truck but I guess he doesn't deserve it or he better leave it at home if he attends a farm show....

[tweety]

VR was the opportunity to solidify the deal. Sure there may be some benefits - although i struggle to find solid evidence of ROI. In the latest Top Crop Manager is a good article on the economics, in the end for the farmer it's a wash. The extra costs and time are better just to add more inputs, rare cases are a benefit like binary fungicide application, lime etc. For data companies its a huge win.

What VR does provide, along with prescription mapping, is the ability for a company to now have access to the intimate details of your land. Production, fertility, application, area, land capability, risk assessment, etc. This data is beyond valuable in assessing your operation. It is not a coincidence that companies generate the maps for you, and that it is too complex for the farmer to do (it really isn't). Even if you do the maps at home, there is that pesky internet thing again. As WD disturbingly pointed out, it should be blatantly obvious that with that cell phone in hand, your IP address, and mac address, you are a walking neon sign in the digital world. You are a valuable money making neon sign worthy to be monitored and you are. Hopefully WD9 can talk about trackers, apps, scary shit.

Imagine if you could see Nutrien's quantity of stock, markup value, purchase cost, units sold, inventory overhead. How much better would you be able to negotiate a price for inputs? Well, they can see yours.

So maybe think twice about what you are giving up for getting nothing really tangible in the end. Auto steer and section control are 95% of all the value of the technology invented for agriculture in the last 25 years. The rest is to extract more from what would have been your net income. The goal is to capture as much of that as possible since there really are no new products that improve production.

Climate was initially a climate company. They wanted to provide models for predicting yields and outcome as a service to farmers. Corn and soybean models were attempted, fairly good weather models attempted. But the shift occurred when Monsanto purchased them. This was the same time data collection was coming on stream and proven extremely lucrative for businesses to know what their customer was interested in. The focus on weather modelling was dropped, all the smart people that started Climate left, crop modelling stopped, never was or never will be a canola model. Since your Canbus contains all the information - like being able to log into the secure network at Nutrien - all the data can be easily recorded. Why yes you need an ipad to run it. Of course you do, Apple are the leaders in harvesting data, sending data without your knowledge. They wrote the book on it.

So everywhere that ipad goes it will eventually connect to a wifi, download anything it wants along with all the identification, and you will never know any better. The thing to do is stop recording it for them in the first place. The privacy policy has changed. Initially a firewall between climate and monsanto, you just clicked agree to an update where that is gone a couple years later. Did you read the agreement? Certain no. Also Climate has a "free" subscription now. Most farmers wouldn't see much of a benefit to it to pay for the subscription, so just give it for free. After all, that isn't where the money is.

Bayer bought the whole mess. To make your farming experience more enjoyable they are coming out with share the risk. Yet another perfect carrot in the mission to find out everything you do. Just the beginning of pricing programs. Now you definitely need a good tracking of the field, inputs, yield... etc to determine it was higher or lower with the product applied. i agree with WD9's prediction, pricing will depend on data harvesting.

Climate Corp, aWare, Farmlogs, OnFarm, Farmers Edge, Agribotix, AgDNA, Conservis, a hundred more all say the same thing. "You the farmer own your data". That's bull. No one owns the data. "All we do is aggregate for the benefit of the farmer." BS again. All data is identifiable right to the finest detail, anonymous data does not exist.

Don't be f-u-c-k-ing stupid. None of it is for your benefit. It is really simple, if there isn't a return of 5 to 10 - like fertilizer or herbicide, don't use it. We grow a wholesale raw product that hasn't changed in thousands of years. Start farming today with that very simple fact in mind.