Weed resistance solutions

[helmsdale]

You guys need to fight kochia with Liberty Gr 10. With the competition from the canola weed we have bred and that chemical there is no kochia problem anywhere around here anymore.

In summerfallow, my f.i.l. did a 1/4 with glufosinate full rate, and 15gal of water... it winged them, but they still set seed, which means the next gen is likely to be partially resistant.

A few guys have resorted to straight up dessication... that's not particularly cost effective!

[helmsdale]

On this topic, what is the accepted wisdom regarding herbicide rates, and developing resistance. I've heard compelling cases supporting both low rates, and high rates to delay resistance.

Not sure what "accepted" would be...

But in this neighborhood, low rates in chemfallow I think have hastened resistance. Probably in combination with advanced staging. It's kind of like the nash equilibrium. Guys that have spent the $$$ in their own fields have definitively kept resistance to a minimum, but all it takes is one plant to roll from the neighbors in a windstorm onto yours that is partially resistant, and now even your higher chem rates struggle to control it in subsequent years. It means that if resistance is inevitable, it's hardly worth spending the extra money to give solid doses since the neighbors will screw you anyway.

Agrologist I talked to with DOW said kochia essentially takes 3 generations to become truly resistant. Stragglers from each generation persist the following year gaining resistance from generation to generation. If for instance you spray as follows:

1st year: dicamba in crop
2nd year: 2 or 3 passes with dicamba mixed in for chemfallow
3rd year: dicamba in crop
4th year (chemfallow): pretty much guaranteed dicamba resistance

[seldomseen]

Diverse crop rotation and diverse range of chem's for as long as that works. So far Kochia is not up here in the NE as far as i know. I have never grown any glyf resistant crops so that option should still be available. Wild oats and cleavers are the ones that will cause problems here. If all else fails retirement.

[jamesb]

Interesting thoughts and strategies. In my observation of the corn /soybean rotation in much of the Midwest US there seems to me that they are slowly losing the war with weed resistance because of their reliance on roundup. Kochia for us is bad one. Edge for lentils or Clearfield canola really helps. Good old 24D is one that I feel can be hard on the barley but used at the right staging seems to work. Ideally if I can have a four year rotation on crops with breaks on chemical groups I do believe it is manageable. Heat(14) added with the roundup appears to work good. Express (2) really fell short for us. For the first time in probably 30 years I got some liquid treflan and sprayed it on a quarter where I was going after Japanese brome that i knew would come in a barley field that has no in crop choices.
It has been a struggle because it seems we are making cropping decisions based on economic returns and not enough emphasis on sustainability. I was looking at Dwayne Becks stuff online the other day and his "warm season / cool season" strategy makes sense but the short coming is in the economics of some of the crops.

[helmsdale]

What are guys opinions on "Olympus" for going after group 1 resistant wild oats and foxtail barley?

I have a 1/4 that is absolutely infested with group 1 resistant wild oats. Trouble is I don't want to get overly reliant on group 2 control in cereals, or I'll be left with either avadex or edge in peas/lentils, whih is certainly not easy on the pocketbook. And god forbid i lose efficacy of edge, I'll be up shit creek without a paddle when it comes to group 1 resistant wild oats in yellow mustard which doesn't put up much of a fight until it bolts...

The only other option I see, is trying to delay seeding and catch them with RU pre-seed, and hit the stragglers with the uber expensive group 27 in crop.

Anyone seeing group 2 resistance in wild oats yet, and if so, how many apps of group 2 in-crop did it take for resistane to show up?

[Sheepwheat]

Grasses become resistant to group twos far faster than group one modes. Honestly, what is hay worth in your area, and does the yield stack up?

[zeefarmer]

We've tried to be proactive on managing resistance, especially from watching what has happened in the southern US with waterhemp and Palmer Amaranth. Different crops other than the area norm of durum and lentils, pre-emerge, different MOA and groups, tank mixing, granulars, even hand picking on boundaries and NG leases, terminating problem spots incrop and using a weed wick in lentils. It can get expensive, but yield loss and playing catch up isn't cheap either.

It's amazing how some are totally oblivious to resistance. Have neighbours that flat out believe weeds can't become resistant to chemicals, yet scratch their heads when Solo doesn't kill stinkweed and Persian darnel in their CL lentils.

[helmsdale]

Grasses become resistant to group twos far faster than group one modes. Honestly, what is hay worth in your area, and does the yield stack up?

Plenty of years here the gophers have to pack a lunch from june on...

[Goodtime]

I will sell to the Hutts.

[Guest]

Diverse crop rotation and diverse range of chem's for as long as that works. So far Kochia is not up here in the NE as far as i know. I have never grown any glyf resistant crops so that option should still be available. Wild oats and cleavers are the ones that will cause problems here. If all else fails retirement.

yea , thats what I'm thinking
as far as kochia , that field we have across from the old town dump was covered in kochia the year we had the drought in 02 . i picked a bunch , but it never came back , apparently didn't like the swamp

[bucket]

What are guys opinions on "Olympus" for going after group 1 resistant wild oats and foxtail barley?

I have a 1/4 that is absolutely infested with group 1 resistant wild oats. Trouble is I don't want to get overly reliant on group 2 control in cereals, or I'll be left with either avadex or edge in peas/lentils, whih is certainly not easy on the pocketbook. And god forbid i lose efficacy of edge, I'll be up shit creek without a paddle when it comes to group 1 resistant wild oats in yellow mustard which doesn't put up much of a fight until it bolts...

The only other option I see, is trying to delay seeding and catch them with RU pre-seed, and hit the stragglers with the uber expensive group 27 in crop.

Anyone seeing group 2 resistance in wild oats yet, and if so, how many apps of group 2 in-crop did it take for resistane to show up?

I can say Olympus was effective on foxtail barley...

[helmsdale]

I can say Olympus was effective on foxtail barley...

Did you follow it in-crop with anything?

They recommend varro or velocity m3? Obviously aiming for group 1 resistant oats?