Breaking the law: How the state weaponizes an unjust criminal justice system

[chuckChuck]

Just some random thoughts.

I have been exposed to all sides of this debate. Went to University with and got to know people of all races and backgrounds, one of the most interesting I go to know very well was one of the original Vietnamese boat people, incredible story of coming to Canada, and the limited options available once here, which drove most of his peers into gangs. He triumphed and was taking engineering as a mature student while working and supporting a family. The opportunities are there, but he probably had to work 10 times harder than any of us to achieve the same thing.

A close neighbor of ours when I was growing up was one of Canada's most famous( or infamous) white supremacists. Us kids and their kids being the same age and good friends, we visited back and forth regularly. And my parents are likely the most tolerant people you could meet, would certainly not be associated with such activities. Never the slightest hint of the vitriol that was attributed to him in the media, never did figure out where the real truth lies. Still know a couple of his children, not a topic that comes up in conversation.

We had a black friend who would come to visit when we were very young, and if Mom hadn't told me later on that he was black, I wouldn't have been aware of that fact in hindsight, just another kid.

Thinking about all the FN people I know well, vs all the FN people the police regularly encounter, and realize that they are as different as is possible. Impossible to draw any generalizations, other than to state that they are at least as capable as anyone else of achieving great things if the motivation is there, and the demotivators aren't.

Most universities and colleges are full of hard working a successful students from all backgrounds. I think one of the issues is many people in rural areas don't have much contact with successful minorities and they often revert to the stereotypes.

Personal drive will overcome many of the obstacles children face given the right circumstance. But where you are born and who your parents are have a big impact on what options you have. University and college are not an option for many kids because there are not the financial resources available. There are many working poor single parents who have hard time keeping the necessities of life together. I doubt they can afford an RESP or the tuition especially if they have several kids.

[bobofthenorth]

True, Canada’s history is different and we don’t have for profit prisons. But First Nations are over represented in the prison population.

Here's a thought - Indians are "over represented" in prisons because that's who is doing the crime. And by the way, this also explains the missing and murdered Indian women problem that you lefties like to whine about - they're going missing and murdered because their husbands, brothers, boy friends, fathers, uncles and assorted other male relatives are killing them.

We have just heard from the RCMP Commissioner that we do have systemic racism in Canada.

That entirely depends which day you were listening to that ass kissing, boot licking chubby nitwit.

Black people along with First Nations have been telling us they are regularly discriminated against and are often subject to police harassment and violence.

Yet again you are reading selectively. There are numerous instances where people of colour have vehemently stated that they are NOT subject to racism. That in fact the reason 100s of 1000s of refugees are clamoring to enter Canada is precisely because of our tolerance.

[chuckChuck]

Misery loves company. Many of the 2 races u worry about resent it when one of their own gets ahead so they try and drag them back down to their level. They love it when they can all get down to the basement level and bitch and complain about how they have been wronged. No one can tell me that a welfare cheque gives u incentive to better yourself. Apparently a way to a better life now is to take what u want by rioting.

Really Junkie? You are stereotyping and spreading racist bullshit. Open your eyes man.

Its a small minority of protesters who will riot and loot. Most are just opportunists who take advantage of the situation. The majority of protesters are peaceful.

Some rural residents will steal fuel, cattle, batteries, grain, equipment, parts, tools. Anybody who steals grain or farm stuff is most often a farmer. There is not much of market for stolen grain if you are not a farmer. But I don't call all farmers thieves and looters.

[chuckChuck]

Hate and hope in Thunder Bay: A city grapples with racism against Indigenous people

In this Ontario city, racism against Indigenous people has taken a deadly toll. Police and political leaders are being asked to do better. How they respond could shape the future of reconciliation in Canada

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-hate-and-hope-in-thunder-bay-a-city-grapples-with-racism-against/ https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-hate-and-hope-in-thunder-bay-a-city-grapples-with-racism-against/

n the end, Mr. McNeilly said that nine of the 37 Thunder Bay police investigations he examined were so flawed that they should be reopened. They included four of the high-school students whose deaths had been examined by Dr. Eden during the coroner’s inquest:

Jethro Anderson, 15, from Kasabonika Lake First Nation, and who had spoken only Oji-Cree until Grade 7, disappeared on Oct. 28, 2000. Although there was bruising on his body and reports that he had been beaten, the police quickly issued a statement saying no foul play was suspected. The coroner found his cause of death to be undetermined.
Curran Strang, 18, from Pikangikum First Nation, was reported missing on Sept. 22, 2005. When his body was found four days later, face down in the McIntyre River, he had no shirt or socks on, and, although his pants were up, they were undone. An autopsy revealed a high blood-alcohol level and red marks on his shins. After a limited investigation, the police declared there to have been no foul play. His death was ruled an accident by the coroner’s jury.
Kyle Morrisseau, 17, from Keewaywin First Nation, and a grandson of Ojibwa painter Norval Morrisseau, was last seen alive on Oct. 31, 2009. There were suggestions he had been killed over a drug debt. When his body was pulled from the McIntyre Floodway on Nov. 10 of the same year, there was an abrasion on the left side of his nose, and his face appeared swollen. In his report, Mr. McNeilly found that the police had ignored many of the tips they were given about his case. The coroner ruled his death to be an accident.
Jordan Wabasse, 15, from Webequie First Nation, and a star hockey player, was reported missing on Feb. 8, 2011. His body was not found until the following May 10. There were multiple witnesses who said he had been the victim of mistaken identity on the part of those who killed him, and that he had been thrown off a bridge by members of the Native Syndicate street gang, who wanted another man for drug debts. The police did suspect foul play at the time, but leads were not checked, the OIPRD found. The coroner ruled the cause of death as undetermined.

Office of the Independent Police Review Director recommendations

Recommendations regarding Thunder Bay Police Service investigations:
Nine of the TBPS sudden death investigations that the OIPRD reviewed are so problematic I recommend these cases be reinvestigated.
A multi-discipline investigation team should be established to undertake, at a minimum, the reinvestigation of the deaths of the nine Indigenous people identified.
The multi-discipline investigative team should establish a protocol for determining whether other TBPS sudden death investigations should be reinvestigated.
The multi-discipline investigation team should also assess whether the death of Stacy DeBungee should be reinvestigated, based on our Investigative Report and the Ontario Provincial Police review of the TBPS investigation. The team should also assess when and how the investigation should take place, without prejudicing ongoing Police Services Act proceedings.
TBPS should initiate an external peer-review process for at least three years following the release of this report.
Recommendations regarding TBPS investigators and the criminal investigations branch:
TBPS should immediately ensure sufficient staffing in its General Investigation Unit in the Criminal Investigations Branch. Adequate resources must be made available to enable this recommendation to be implemented on an urgent basis.
TBPS should establish a Major Crimes Unit – within the Criminal Investigations Branch – that complies with provincial standards and best practices in how it investigates serious cases, including homicides, sudden deaths and complex cases.
TBPS should provide officers, who have taken the appropriate training with opportunities to be assigned to work with Criminal Investigations Branch and the Major Crimes Unit investigators to gain experience.
TBPS should develop a formalized plan or protocol for training and mentoring officers assigned to Criminal Investigations Branch and the Major Crimes Unit.
TBPS should develop a strategic human resources succession plan to ensure the General Investigations Unit, Criminal Investigations Branch and the Major Crime Unit is never without officers who are experienced in investigations.
TBPS should establish procedures to ensure occurrence or supplementary reports relevant to an investigation are brought to the attention of the lead investigator or case manager. This must take place regardless of whether a case has been earmarked for Major Case Management.
TBPS should develop procedures to ensure forensic identification officers are provided with the information necessary to do their work effectively.
TBPS should immediately improve how it employs, structures and integrates its investigation file management system, Major Case Management system and its Niche database.
TBPS should, on a priority basis, establish protocols with other police services in the region, including Nishnawbe-Aski Police Service and Anishinabek Police Service to enhance information-sharing.
Recommendations regarding other TBPS operational areas:
TBPS should fully integrate the Aboriginal Liaison Unit’s role into additional areas of the police service. This would help to promote respectful relationships between TBPS and the Indigenous people it serves.
TBPS should increase the number of officers in the Aboriginal Liaison Unit by at least three additional officers.
With Indigenous engagement and advice, TBPS should take measures to acknowledge Indigenous culture inside headquarters or immediately outside it.
Thunder Bay Police Service should make wearing name tags on the front of their uniforms mandatory for all officers in the service.
TBPS should implement the use of in-car cameras and body-worn cameras.
TBPS should, through policy, impose and reinforce a positive duty on all officer to disclose potential evidence of police misconduct.
Recommendations regarding missing persons cases:
I urge the Ontario government to bring into force Schedule 7, the Missing Persons Act, 2018, as soon as possible.
TBPS and the Thunder Bay Police Services Board should re-evaluate their missing persons policies, procedures and practices upon review of the report of the National Inquiry into Missing and Murdered Indigenous Women and Girls, due to be released on or before April 30, 2019.
TBPS and the Thunder Bay Police Services Board should re-evaluate their missing persons policies, procedures and practices upon review of the Honourable Gloria Epstein’s report on Toronto Police Service’s missing persons investigations due to be released in April 2020.
Recommendations regarding the relationship between the police and the coroner’s office:
The Office of the Chief Coroner, Ontario’s Chief Forensic Pathologist, the Regional Coroner, and TBPS should implement the Thunder Bay Death Investigations Framework on a priority basis and should evaluate and modify it as required, with the input of the parties, annually.
The Office of the Chief Coroner should ensure police officers and coroners are trained on the framework to promote its effective implementation.
The Office of the Chief Coroner and TBPS should publicly report on the ongoing implementation of the framework in a way that does not prejudice ongoing investigations or prosecutions.
Recommendations regarding the relationship between the police and pathologist:
The Ontario Forensic Pathology Service should train all pathologists on the Intersection of Police and Coroners for Thunder Bay Death Investigations as set out in the framework.
TBPS should reflect, in its procedures and training, fundamental principles to define the relationship between investigators and pathologists.
The Ontario Forensic Pathology Service should establish a Forensic Pathology Unit in Thunder Bay, ideally housed alongside the Regional Coroner’s Office.
If a Forensic Pathology Unit cannot be located in Thunder Bay, TBPS and the Ontario Forensic Pathology Service should establish, on a priority basis, procedures to ensure timely and accurate exchange of information on sudden death and homicide investigations and regular case-conferencing on such cases.
The Ontario Forensic Pathology Service should provide autopsy services compatible with cultural norms in Indigenous communities.
Recommendations regarding racism in TBPS policing – General:
TBPS should focus proactively on actions to eliminate systemic racism, including removing systemic barriers and the root causes of racial inequities in the service. TBPS should undertake a human rights organizational change strategy and action plan as recommended by the Ontario Human Rights Commission in October 2016.

[furrowtickler]

Most universities and colleges are full of hard working a successful students from all backgrounds. I think one of the issues is many people in rural areas don't have much contact with successful minorities and they often revert to the stereotypes.

Personal drive will overcome many of the obstacles children face given the right circumstance. But where you are born and who your parents are have a big impact on what options you have. University and college are not an option for many kids because there are not the financial resources available. There are many working poor single parents who have hard time keeping the necessities of life together. I doubt they can afford an RESP or the tuition especially if they have several kids.

It’s called student loans
We have to do it , will take kids several years to pay off but that’s life

[chuckChuck]

Here's a thought - Indians are "over represented" in prisons because that's who is doing the crime. And by the way, this also explains the missing and murdered Indian women problem that you lefties like to whine about - they're going missing and murdered because their husbands, brothers, boy friends, fathers, uncles and assorted other male relatives are killing them.


That entirely depends which day you were listening to that ass kissing, boot licking chubby nitwit.


Yet again you are reading selectively. There are numerous instances where people of colour have vehemently stated that they are NOT subject to racism. That in fact the reason 100s of 1000s of refugees are clamoring to enter Canada is precisely because of our tolerance.

You are in denial Bob! Racism is a fact of life. People of color are more often have negative experiences with police and the public. You would have to live under a stone not recognize the problem.

How do you know who committed all the crimes against MMIW? Most of the cases are unsolved. Another racist assumption.

Someone in Regina recently saw a black teacher going to his car and posts a photo on social media and writes "Lock your car there are thieves in the neighborhood"! That's racism Bobby. The assumption that a black man is thief!

Your comments about RCMP Commissioner are disgusting. Just because you think there is no racism you show your ugly contempt for those who disagree with you. Comments like those show who who you really are.

Yes First nations commit crime. If you look at any group of poor marginalized people with lots of social problems they often commit crime just to survive because in a racist society the deck is stacked against them. And they usually don't have enough money to hire the best lawyers to represent them. So they end up with more convictions. That's racism Bobby!

[chuckChuck]

Debunking the myth that all First Nations people receive free post-secondary education


https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/debunking-the-myth-that-all-first-nations-people-receive-free-post-secondary-education-1.3414183 https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/debunking-the-myth-that-all-first-nations-people-receive-free-post-secondary-education-1.3414183

[chuckChuck]

It’s called student loans
We have to do it , will take kids several years to pay off but that’s life

Furrow, student loans do not solve all the issues in access to education. Read and learn.

https://www.opencanada.org/features/inequality-explained-hidden-gaps-canadas-education-system/ https://www.opencanada.org/features/inequality-explained-hidden-gaps-canadas-education-system/

Inequality Explained: The hidden gaps in Canada’s education system

While Canada’s education system ranks high among OECD countries, socioeconomic inequality factors in at all levels. This is why it matters.

In addition to behavioural benefits, the schools with a higher proportion of wealthy students (i.e. those in high-income neighbourhoods) receive a higher academic ranking. Statistics Canada shows that “the higher socio-economic status of private school students and their peers accounts for half of the difference in the average score of standardized tests between private and public school students.” This achievement gap widens and enforces income inequality by supporting the future success of high-income students and leaving low-income students behind.

Lowest income bracket: On average, the situation for students in low-income families is entirely different. They face inequalities beyond just access to academic and extracurricular support. This becomes obvious when looking at the one in five children in British Columbia who currently live in poverty, without safe and secure housing, basic necessities such as warm clothing, and access to sufficient food. In Toronto and elsewhere, household instability and poverty may be contributing to the underrepresentation of low-income students with a ‘gifted’ designation (unusually high intellect) and overrepresentation of this group in the ‘special needs’ categorization.

[chuckChuck]

In the USA there is a reason so many blacks are over represented in prison because they often plead guilty to avoid the risk of longer sentences if they don't take a plea deal. If your poor and black can you hire the best lawyers? Nope


"Not everyone goes to trial. If every single person had a trial, the entire system would shut down. It often comes down to: you can take this plea deal and go to jail for three years, or you can go to trial and go to jail for 30 years if you lose. As a result, 97% of people do not go to trial and instead take a plea bargain."

[furrowtickler]

Yup some good points
Also what helps is working part time and summer jobs to help pay your own way