CEBA

[AlbertaFarmer5]

My position on this is that the purpose of these programs is to get money into circulation so the entire system doesn't lock up and come crashing down, and so far it is working as designed, inspite of the obvious undesired side effects, and long term consequences. Regardless if a business or individual can justify hardship due to Covid, accept the funds, and get them into the economy. One farmer making a stand and doing the right thing is only going to put him( or her) at a disadvantage to anyone else who does take it.

This debt is never getting paid off anyways, no point in using that argument as justification.

[dalek]

FCC statement for what?

My farm mortgage

[the big wheel]

My position on this is that the purpose of these programs is to get money into circulation so the entire system doesn't lock up and come crashing down, and so far it is working as designed, inspite of the obvious undesired side effects, and long term consequences. Regardless if a business or individual can justify hardship due to Covid, accept the funds, and get them into the economy. One farmer making a stand and doing the right thing is only going to put him( or her) at a disadvantage to anyone else who does take it.

This debt is never getting paid off anyways, no point in using that argument as justification.

Very true statement. When you consider how many times this money will be handed from one person to the next and taxed each time how much is this really costing? The alternative would have been what????
There were many mistakes made with how it was handed out though. For example the rent subsidy maybe should have went directly to the landlord? If it’s purpose was so you had a roof over your head then that’s what it should have gone for. But some people kept it never paid the rent although if it was to buy food then ok but I’d it was to buy Netflix then not while the landlord never got paid. But then again not an easy thing to do on relatively short notice to satisfy every shortfall. The economy would have been totally dead. This money did actually help a lot of businesses keep going.
It’s going to be a huge mistake for the conservatives to keep knocking this because the alternative would have been way worse.

[bucket]

I have said it on other threads....CEBA and CERB are bank bailouts....

[dalek]

I have said it on other threads....CEBA and CERB are bank bailouts....

They’re helping the banks and making sure the utility and insurance companies get paid. Beyond that they don’t care

[burnt]

I have said it on other threads....CEBA and CERB are bank bailouts....

Bank bailouts - reminiscent of a piece I wrote quite a few years ago, as the numbers in the story will show:

Small Change

The stranger surveyed the empty seats as he walked into the local coffee shop. Since it was obvious that none of them suited him, I motioned for him to sit at my table. Nodding his thanks, he pulled up his chair.

It was then that I noticed his bunched-up hand come out of his pocket holding a sizable collection of coins - pennies, nickels dimes, quarters and loonies.

“Gooday”, he said with a Francophone accent while sorting through the change in his hand. “How much is a coffee?” he asked as the waitress headed our way with a mug and coffee pot in hand.

“Dollar”, was the reply as the brew was served. He seemed to be preoccupied with sorting the smallest pieces of change into neat piles on the table. Five pennies per stack… let’s see, coupla’ nickels, some dimes and a quarter to make one dollar. “I like to use up my change before I get home” was his explanation.

He was a truck driver who worked for a farmer in Eastern Ontario and having picked up his return load, stopped for a bit of caffeine to help keep him sharp for the seven or eight hour trip back home. And as happens so easily over a good cup of coffee in farm country on a rainy day, we were soon deep in conversation which dealt with the dreadfully serious issues of the day.

We came up with some stunningly simple solutions for many of them. Had his trailer been empty, it would not likely have held the cargo of candid suggestions for the folks who run our fair land from out his way.

We shook our heads in deep dismay at the mention of horrendously high prices farmers were being forced to pay if they wanted to rent or buy land nowadays; why, corn was four dollars a bushel in the 70’s when a fella could rent land for sixty five dollars an acre! How’s it supposed to work a one-sixty-five or two hundred? Or five or six thousand an acre to buy it?

Feeling the pain of those attempting to do so compelled me to share my own painful start-up experience in farming. “It was 1981 when I bought my first farm, 50 acres at twelve hundred an acre and interest at 16% from Farm Credit. As Jim signed over the deed for the land he had just sold me he said ‘Johnnie, this year corn is four dollars a bushel and next year it will be five’,” I recounted to the stranger as I quietly relived that distant moment.

“And was it?” the stranger whispered hoarsely over the sound of the pouring rain.

“Nope”, I replied in a low voice, “corn dropped to two-fifty and my operating loan jumped to twenty-two percent. You see, Jim was a Liberal.”

Shocked almost to the point of disbelief, he asked me, “How did you ever survive?”

“Same way as everyone else did in the achin’ eighties - the government kept sending out little trickles of money to keep the farmers going. Lots of us think they knew just how much it would take to keep the banks from losing too much money on bad loans. Those bankers got friends in high places, you know.”
The stranger drained his cup and shook his head in amazement at his new-found understanding as he pushed back his chair. “Gotta go home” he said.

“By the way, where’s home?” I asked as he rose to leave. He swept the pile of small change into his hand and let it trickle onto the counter to pay the bill.

“Ottawa,” he replied.

The rain stopped, the sun burst out and suddenly it all made sense. I guess that’s just the way they do it out there.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Eligible Non-Deferrable expenses are comprised of the following:

Wages and other employment expenses to independent (arm’s length) third parties;
Rent or lease payments for real estate used for business purposes;
Rent or lease payments for capital equipment used for business purposes;
Payments incurred for insurance related costs;
Payments incurred for property taxes;
Payments incurred for business purposes for telephone and utilities in the form of gas, oil, electricity, water and internet;
Payments for regularly scheduled debt service;
Payments incurred under agreements with independent contractors and fees required in order to maintain licenses, authorizations or permissions necessary to conduct business by the Borrower.

Trying to figure what expenses we could use out of this list.
Arms length wages is a good start.
Don't lease anything.
Rent not nearly enough.
No crop insurance or other big insurance bills.
Property taxes don't get me much closer.
Utilities add up in a hurry. But that is a lot of bills to send.
Regularly scheduled debt service, if this includes mortgages, then this would be all I need. No other debt expenses. Just scan bank statements?
I'm not sure what expenses a farmer would have in the last category?

[AlbertaFarmer5]

How do you interpret this. Our year end is Oct 31. Our 2019 taxes weren't filed until into 2020. Does this ask when the return was filed, or the most recent tax year which was filed?

the most recent year in which the Borrower has filed an income tax return with the CRA is

[the big wheel]

Trying to figure what expenses we could use out of this list.
Arms length wages is a good start.
Don't lease anything.
Rent not nearly enough.
No crop insurance or other big insurance bills.
Property taxes don't get me much closer.
Utilities add up in a hurry. But that is a lot of bills to send.
Regularly scheduled debt service, if this includes mortgages, then this would be all I need. No other debt expenses. Just scan bank statements?
I'm not sure what expenses a farmer would have in the last category?

So don’t they look at a guys income tax? It’s mostly all
There rent, insurance, etc etc. Mortgage wouldn’t be I guess.

[dalek]

Trying to figure what expenses we could use out of this list.
Arms length wages is a good start.
Don't lease anything.
Rent not nearly enough.
No crop insurance or other big insurance bills.
Property taxes don't get me much closer.
Utilities add up in a hurry. But that is a lot of bills to send.
Regularly scheduled debt service, if this includes mortgages, then this would be all I need. No other debt expenses. Just scan bank statements?
I'm not sure what expenses a farmer would have in the last category?

You don’t have to send every utility bill. Put in the one(s) for a recent month then it asks you if it’s a monthly bill and automatically multiplies it by 12