Farm Solar Scam

[AlbertaFarmer5]

I priced out a system recently. 17KW DC/15KW AC at $1.43/watt (modules, wiring, inverter, and racking). Plan on doing it myself so labour costs shouldn't be too bad.

Have you looked into using your Tesla battery as storage? Would that improve the economics?

[Oliver88]

I priced out a system recently. 17KW DC/15KW AC at $1.43/watt (modules, wiring, inverter, and racking). Plan on doing it myself so labour costs shouldn't be too bad.

$24,310 + your labour?
You will be able to run 5 HP aeration fans only when it is sunny out?

[ALBERTAFARMER4]

Have you looked into using your Tesla battery as storage? Would that improve the economics?

Vehicle to grid (v2g) is not available for Tesla vehicles. I think Nissan Leaf has this capability. It's in the future once EV batteries can have a million mile life (Sept 22 of this year).

[ALBERTAFARMER4]

$24,310 + your labour?
You will be able to run 5 HP aeration fans only when it is sunny out?

$21,800, I calculated the cost per watt on the AC power because that is what you actually use. This system will be for our house and will displace the annual energy used by the house and charging 2 cars.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

$21,800, I calculated the cost per watt on the AC power because that is what you actually use. This system will be for our house and will displace the annual energy used by the house and charging 2 cars.

Charging EV's with solar actually makes a lot of sense, at least in your case, as a farmer, your vehicles likely sit at home unused during the sunny part of the day. You can use the power while it is being produced, instead of selling the excess into the midday glut when solar is at its peak, and inevitably, smart meters will punish grid tied systems like Chuck's.

How those economics, and logistics will work for the average 9-5 er is not so certain.

[ALBERTAFARMER4]

Charging EV's with solar actually makes a lot of sense, at least in your case, as a farmer, your vehicles likely sit at home unused during the sunny part of the day. You can use the power while it is being produced, instead of selling the excess into the midday glut when solar is at its peak, and inevitably, smart meters will punish grid tied systems like Chuck's.

How those economics, and logistics will work for the average 9-5 er is not so certain.

Agreed. Solar may not be a good use of capital depending on your location or needs. That is why it’s critical to do the math. In Alberta we have no time of use billing so it doesn’t matter when you buy or sell.

[chuckChuck]

Wow. A5 actually said something positive about solar! There is hope after all. hahah

Most cars sit doing nothing all day at work or at home and can easily soak up some excess solar electricity for charging. It's the elusive Solar storage you were waiting for A5. LOL

Electricity prices keep rising. Solar system prices keep falling. The cost of my 25 kw system is about the same as a nice new pickup and it will pay for itself in about 10 years and we should have another 15 or 20 years of cheap electricity. My estimate of lifetime cost per kwh is about 8 cents. Sask Power charges 14 cents and is rising about 3% per year. A lot will depend on how many panels or inverters fail.

I haven't bought a new car or a pickup that has paid for itself in 10 years and then almost cost nothing to run for the next 15 - 20 years. Most overpriced luxury pickups are ego driven vanity projects, unlike solar which actually captures a free unlimited infinite resource from the sun and turns it into very useful electricity!

[Hamloc]

Wow. A5 actually said something positive about solar! There is hope after all. hahah

Most cars sit doing nothing all day at work or at home and can easily soak up some excess solar electricity for charging. It's the elusive Solar storage you were waiting for A5. LOL

Electricity prices keep rising. Solar system prices keep falling. The cost of my 25 kw system is about the same as a nice new pickup and it will pay for itself in about 10 years and we should have another 15 or 20 years of cheap electricity. My estimate of lifetime cost per kwh is about 8 cents. Sask Power charges 14 cents and is rising about 3% per year. A lot will depend on how many panels or inverters fail.

I haven't bought a new car or a pickup that has paid for itself in 10 years and then almost cost nothing to run for the next 15 - 20 years. Most overpriced luxury pickups are ego driven vanity projects, unlike solar which actually captures a free unlimited infinite resource from the sun and turns it into very useful electricity!

Ok Chuck I would like to see the math. Is your system a ground mount or roof mount? What did it cost per installed watt? Did you install it yourself or hire it done? What are you payed per watt for the electricity you sell to the grid? The most recent prices I can find are roughly $1.45-$1.50 a watt, for a roof system and that is no installation charges, so I call bull#*#* on prices still going down, I would say they have plateaued at $2.50 to $2.60 per installed watt. One other question you have this problem with farmers buying pickups, how much of the price of your solar system was subsidized by the government, I don’t think pickups fall under direct government subsidy programs!!!

[ColevilleH2S]

... unlike solar which actually captures a free unlimited infinite resource from the sun and turns it into very useful electricity!

What was old, is new again.
Farmers have been at this solar thing for a few millennia before the electical engineers figured it out.

[jazz]

chuck is the ultimate physics denier, but just typing his troll posts produces more energy density than solar does.

He totally misses the fact that it was fossil fuels that eliminated human servitude. And now wants us to go back to that dark age.

[tweety]

chuck is the ultimate physics denier, but just typing his troll posts produces more energy density than solar does.

He totally misses the fact that it was fossil fuels that eliminated human servitude. And now wants us to go back to that dark age.

It may have eliminated it for the rich, but, every five days, the sun provides the Earth with as much energy as all proven supplies of oil, coal, and natural gas. If humanity could capture just one 6,000th of Earth’s available solar energy, we’d be able to meet 100 percent of our energy needs.

So where do you think the future lies? In a constantly declining EROI for a limited supply of oil and gas? Today its all we got, no argument there, but tomorrow will be different. Change the rules on how electricity is charged for and it will be even a sooner tomorrow.

Oh and your chart is wrong, energy from the sun is around 1000 watts per sq meter.

[jazz]

So where do you think the future lies? In a constantly declining EROI for a limited supply of oil and gas? Today its all we got, no argument there, but tomorrow will be different. Change the rules on how electricity is charged for and it will be even a sooner tomorrow.
.

If solar is an absolute must for people and they want to ignore nuclear or avoid real investment into fusion, then its going to have to be put into orbit to take up the smallest footprint and access 100% of the sun every day every year.

There are orbital launches every month, they could be stringing together an array up there anytime. I think the technology is closer to that than fusion.

If the industry goes that direction, I am fully on board because it solves all the problems.