Open Challenge....Verifying claims with actual Grid Tie energy production.

[fjlip]

"the UK hit a record 47% of its electricity from renewables in the first quarter of 2020.

North Dakota gets 27% of its electricity from wind."


No doubt the rated output at max, real world maybe a quarter of that.

A total feel good virtue signal, oh let's SAVE the planet and have EXPENSIVE on- off electrical
unreliable power supply?

[AlbertaFarmer5]

"the UK hit a record 47% of its electricity from renewables in the first quarter of 2020.

North Dakota gets 27% of its electricity from wind."


No doubt the rated output at max, real world maybe a quarter of that.

A total feel good virtue signal, oh let's SAVE the planet and have EXPENSIVE on- off electrical
unreliable power supply?

But more importantly, at what cost.
Paul Homewood follows this issue in the UK.
https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2020/06/13/dummies-guide-to-renewable-subsidies/ https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2020/06/13/dummies-guide-to-renewable-subsidies/
One of the commenters added it up:

So that would be £464 per household in 2019 (including FITs and capacity market auctions.

And this:
https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2020/02/11/green-subsidies-will-continue-to-push-up-power-prices-for-years-to-come/ https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2020/02/11/green-subsidies-will-continue-to-push-up-power-prices-for-years-to-come/
And the black outs, and the exporting/importing to make it work, especially at times like this:
https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2020/11/27/coal-outperforms-wind-power-in-uk-wind-week/ https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2020/11/27/coal-outperforms-wind-power-in-uk-wind-week/

Almost anything is possible if you can pass the costs on to the consumer, and government will make up any other shortfall, and reliability is no longer considered to be a requirement.

[oneoff]

"the UK hit a record 47% of its electricity from renewables in the first quarter of 2020.

North Dakota gets 27% of its electricity from wind."


No doubt the rated output at max, real world maybe a quarter of that.

A total feel good virtue signal, oh let's SAVE the planet and have EXPENSIVE on- off electrical
unreliable power supply?

The US military is said to have a saying "you can make pigs fly if you put enough horsepower behind them"

In theory you could try to make enough storage (eg. batteries) and when and if you got enough storage to make intermittent solar or wind power work; you'd still have issue of requiring multiple solar panel capacity than peak needs; the batteries don't exist to accomplish this; it would be prohibitively expensive (as in the working technology doesn't exist and rare earth minerals, cobalt and whatever compounds required would have enormous environmental impacts to achieve their extraction and processing.

The same faulty logic applies to thinking cheap renewable energy sources automatically makes cheap end product elecricity for consumers.

Only if you ignore the changeover costs; and close out all thoughts of the still required base energy needs for the 65% to 85% of the time that OTHER base energy supplies have to be ready and able on minutes to extended periods of time when those intermittent supplies just aren't capable of performing up to necessary demands and expectations.

How many times does a person have to say that?

[fjlip]

You will need a BIGGER 2x4!
THEY repeat a LIE often enough....try to make us believe/NOT think/don't Reason/don't read facts/deny the truth.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

The US military is said to have a saying "you can make pigs fly if you put enough horsepower behind them"

In theory you could try to make enough storage (eg. batteries) and when and if you got enough storage to make intermittent solar or wind power work; you'd still have issue of requiring multiple solar panel capacity than peak needs; the batteries don't exist to accomplish this; it would be prohibitively expensive (as in the working technology doesn't exist and rare earth minerals, cobalt and whatever compounds required would have enormous environmental impacts to achieve their extraction and processing.

The same faulty logic applies to thinking cheap renewable energy sources automatically makes cheap end product elecricity for consumers.

Only if you ignore the changeover costs; and close out all thoughts of the still required base energy needs for the 65% to 85% of the time that OTHER base energy supplies have to be ready and able on minutes to extended periods of time when those intermittent supplies just aren't capable of performing up to necessary demands and expectations.

How many times does a person have to say that?

Well said.
I've tried saying it every way possible, and used analogies, all to no effect. They just keep repeating cheapest generation source, ignoring the fact that it ( so far) always results in drastically higher enduser costs.

[sumdumguy]

Dumber than a 2 by 4.

[oneoff]

I'll take your quotes off.... and repeat your statement . It's been repeated enough times.. but has had zero impact.. so we might just as well let repetition fail to convince as to restate the obvious in a slightly different way


AlbertaFarmer5;480770]Well said.
I've tried saying it every way possible, and used analogies, all to no effect. They just keep repeating cheapest generation source, ignoring the fact that it ( so far) always results in drastically higher enduser costs.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Just for information Saskatoon City Solar Demonstration Site ....thats minutes ago today 1:45pm 33Kw solar panel boiler plate ratings and 304 watts output at that minute. Totally piss poor insignificant production; but giving it another hour and it will be shutting down for 20 plus hours and about 10:30 capable of firing up those three 100 watt incandescent bulbs once again.

Do you really want to rely on that in the middle of a cold Sask night.

Compared to that, Brooks is a roaring success.
Only 75 acres of good farmland, and yesterday it managed to produce 0.2 MW's of electricity for almost 10 minutes out of the entire day. Using your lightbulb comparison, that would power almost fourteen 100 Watt bulbs for a day. Good thing the wind started blowing again.

[TSIPP]

But But But, in cold weather, solar is so much more efficient.

[oneoff]

But But But, in cold weather, solar is so much more efficient.

Angle of incidence equals angle of reflection...or something like that. Cool it to absolute zero and it will work really well.

So maybe complicate a solar panel system by incorporating a genetically engineered sunflower head that follows the sun. Mother nature did actually create a working system.

But humans have found that so far the computer controls and linkages have only added costs (and complications and failure points) that doesn't pay for efficiency gains achieved.

And those are some of reasons why even chucks arrays don't move in real time. There are differences between what is possible and what is practical (even though a few advantages have been are theoretically identified in specific cases)