Opinion Poll

[SASKFARMER]

Chuck instead of BLAH BLAH BLAH answer the ****ing question.

[chuckChuck]

Simple question Chuck which is a greater threat to your farms future viability C02 in the atmosphere or a $170 CAD carbon tax?!

The greatest risk on my farm is always weather. If I get 1/2 a crop next year because of drought or flood, the losses will amount to hundreds of thousands of dollars of lost income that will make the impact of a carbon tax look insignificant.

Climate scientists have already identified the increasing frequency of extreme weather events as symptomatic of climate change.

[Misterjade9]

He has a habit of that, doesn't he. Yea the increase in the so called carbon tax will be the death knell for a lot of businesses, but it will be especially bad in primary ag production because we have no way to pass any cost on. Increase's in regulations, what you can or cannot do, to grow a crop, will be just as damaging to ag production as well. As was stated in the carbon tax efficiency thread I see fertilizer as the only area we can somewhat improve our efficiency in. That however will depend solely on new varieties that will be much more efficient in fert. use, however the seed tax will probably offset any potential savings. A number of you talk about us becoming nothing but serfs, but are we not there already? We may own some land, but there are very few of us that are not beholden to a bank, FCC, equipment finance companies, input suppliers ,and even like some of my neighbors, major investors. All of the aforementioned will be able to pass off any extra costs from the carbon tax directly to us.

[Hamloc]

The greatest risk on my farm is always weather. If I get 1/2 a crop next year because of drought or flood, the losses will amount to hundreds of thousands of dollars of lost income that will make the impact of a carbon tax look insignificant.

Climate scientists have already identified the increasing frequency of extreme weather events as symptomatic of climate change.

So you believe a $170 carbon tax will change the weather?!

[chuckChuck]

Nope. Weather is weather and climate is what happens over decades.

But are you going to ignore the impact climate change can have on the intensity or frequency of extreme weather events? Or the impact it has on the jet stream and extended periods of blocking patterns?

It's all in the peer reviewed published climate science.

Every province if they want to can design a carbon pricing system that supports farmers. Most would rather blame the feds than support their own farmers.

[Sodbuster]

You can keep raising the carbon tax all you want, when it gets high enough it will kill the industry and it will move to another country where tax is less. The only way the tax will work here is if we follow what the US does and use the same tax scheme. Both countries depend on each other for free trade, to have Canada go alone on carbon tax will only push manufacturing and other industries to move south. At the end of the day if industries move or don’t move the world emissions will not change, for e every job that quits here will open another job elsewhere, so zero effect.

[foragefarmer]

Forage, if Trudeau wins an election this yr, that puts him halfway to 2030. The tax rises every yr from here out.

Curious what other issues are more pressing that an industry under direct attack by its own govt?

Wasn't it Mulroney who started the GST and Harper who reduced it by 2%. So, again a lot of changes can happen in ten years.

As to your second question, I would be a lot more worried about Capital Gains being reduced or eliminated to all farmers and farmers who have formed corporations. Way more money to be concerned about if that happens.

[jazz]

News to the world, we have already had droughts and floods 30-40 yrs ago before climate change wasnt even an idea yet.

And ag is still here. In fact yeilds have risen since climate change was pushed on us.

A properly designed insurance program will do more to help us survive the adverse weather events more than any carbon tax. Did the govt put any money toward that?

[jazz]

As to your second question, I would be a lot more worried about Capital Gains being reduced or eliminated to all farmers and farmers who have form corporations. Way more money to be concerned about if that happens.

I liked your comment forage. That is a huge concern as well and we are looking to crystalize our gains with sale to the company and at least protect some of it.

But the application of it would be an issue. To eliminate CG on farmland only and not Toronto housing, how would the govt pull that one off? I would say thats unconstitutional.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Simple question Chuck which is a greater threat to your farms future viability C02 in the atmosphere or a $170 CAD carbon tax?!

The biggest threat to Chuck's farm is that his mom steps on one of his tractors on her way to the basement and not only breaks the tractor, but gets mad and throws the entire line of equipment outside in the snow.
The CO2 tax doesn't have much effect on carpet farmers. And carpet doesn't sequester much CO2 either.

[agstar77]

The carbon tax will be irrelevant as we move away from carbon fuels. Climate will always be an issue . Whether CO2 will be the main culprit is an open question. If it is we don't seem to have the will to change it. Whether you believe in the CO2 armagedon or not , we better hope science is wrong.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Wasn't it Mulroney who started the GST and Harper who reduced it by 2%. So, again a lot of changes can happen in ten years.

As to your second question, I would be a lot more worried about Capital Gains being reduced or eliminated to all farmers and farmers who have formed corporations. Way more money to be concerned about if that happens.

Capital Gains doesn't affect the ongoing viability of your farm or business. That is an end of career concern. If you have accrued capital gain throughout your career, then something about the business must have been viable, or else you wouldn't have been able to purchase and hang onto those appreciating assets.
CO2 tax is applicable at every stage of the business, and directly affect viability and profitability.

[Guest]

Was reading Quebec’s cap and trade carbon policy will keep them at 17 bucks while we move towards 170. Should we be going their way? Would allow us to sell credits more easily, correct?

its for keebeck only

[jazz]

CO2 tax is applicable at every stage of the business, and directly affect viability and profitability.

I think you missed part of that AF, if I have to pay carbon taxes for this transition, crystalizing CG would ensure I wouldnt pay insane income taxes along side of it. Pain containment. Control what I can.

We have got to be at peak prices now anyway. Any industry with a heavy handed tax on it does not continue to appreciate. Look at the oil patch.

[TOM4CWB]

Nope. Weather is weather and climate is what happens over decades.

But are you going to ignore the impact climate change can have on the intensity or frequency of extreme weather events? Or the impact it has on the jet stream and extended periods of blocking patterns?

It's all in the peer reviewed published climate science.

Every province if they want to can design a carbon pricing system that supports farmers. Most would rather blame the feds than support their own farmers.

Chuck2 Climate is 95% dependant on the sun's radiant output... the radiant heat delivered to our earth over decades and Centuries and millennia. Since we have no ability to control the sun's power... we can work on our responsibilities to be good stewards of our Earth.

Canada being 'Net Zero' CO2 by 2050 is achievable and a part of the Conservative environmental platform in the next election. Alberta has had a CO2 heavy industry trading regulation for almost a decade.

US carbon policy will be key to establishing where Canada will go on CO2, as we are integrated in a North American civilization that rationally would continue to coordinate energy and environmental policies and regulations.

We in western Canada do not operate in a bubble ... CO2 , politically, environmentally, commerce, trade, or as a society.

Clearly there is going to be [already is ] a global value on greenhouse gasses/CO2, which must be respected and accommodated particularly in the G7 / WTO global trading economy.

How we prosper and sustain our civilization in a responsible manner is the Challenge! Erin O'Toole as our leader has great ideas and vision to lead Canada to be net zero by 2050!