A climate success story: How Alberta got off coal power

[chuckChuck]

Look at the capacity factor BSR1 for the last day! And current production is almost maxed out. Alberta has one of the best wind resource profiles in all of Canada. Especially with all the "hot air" coming out of A5. LOL

[AlbertaFarmer5]

If it makes you feel any better Chuck, you are in good company with your ignorance of weather in Alberta.
Leonardo Dicaprio doesn't know what a chinook is either.
But surprisingly CBC does. https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/leonardo-dicaprio-chinooks-climate-change-1.3358972&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwjr-sDqgP7tAhXYrZ4KHaDaA0YQFjAAegQIBxAB&usg=AOvVaw2xu3 TfROQjO_uktFG2h_fZ https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/leonardo-dicaprio-chinooks-climate-change-1.3358972&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwjr-sDqgP7tAhXYrZ4KHaDaA0YQFjAAegQIBxAB&usg=AOvVaw2xu3 TfROQjO_uktFG2h_fZ

[AlbertaFarmer5]

So how does showing that wind farms make electricity when the wind blows thanks to a strong Chinook in any way prove that it is in phase with demand?
Affordable?
Doing anything to curb CO2 emissions?
Scalable?
In fact, it proves exactly what I am saying, in the winter, in Alberta, wind power peaks at exactly the wrong times. And solar doesn't even peak, but if you call it a peak, it too is at exactly the wrong time.

If we cut off all oxygen to the patient half the time at random times, sometimes for days at a time, then make up for it by giving him twice as much as he needs in between times, what will be the outcome?

[Hamloc]

So how does showing that wind farms make electricity when the wind blows thanks to a strong Chinook in any way prove that it is in phase with demand?
Affordable?
Doing anything to curb CO2 emissions?
Scalable?
In fact, it proves exactly what I am saying, in the winter, in Alberta, wind power peaks at exactly the wrong times. And solar doesn't even peak, but if you call it a peak, it too is at exactly the wrong time.

If we cut off all oxygen to the patient half the time at random times, sometimes for days at a time, then make up for it by giving him twice as much as he needs in between times, what will be the outcome?

Certainly agree and the fact that in reality no amount of battery storage can make up for the historically proven periods when there is no wind or solar resource in the middle of an arctic high in winter in Alberta for periods that can be longer than a week! Can wind generate power? Absolutely but not in a manner that would ever eliminate the need for some sort of dependable rapidly scaleable back up generation and no one in the green dream community ever accounts for this cost!!!

[Guest]

Arctic highs in NE Sk deep in the swamp can last 6 weeks
Not like Vancouver or toronto

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Arctic highs in NE Sk deep in the swamp can last 6 weeks
Not like Vancouver or toronto

Not that much different than Vancouver where the Sun neglects to shine for months on end.

[oneoff]

Is the occasional concession that "diesel will be required for a long time" or that an intermittent energy source has periods of good "capacity factor"; or that organic food production absolutely mustl replace the chemical fertilizer/herbicide poisoned food of present day farming that currently sustains the masses who would otherwise starve.
What is not acknowledged is the self interests of such souls who benefit most from the positions they have created for themselves.

Looking at the picture from that of a common consumer who don't require 60,000 Kwh of electricity a year; who doesn't get fuel delivered by tridem fuel trucks; doesn't even have a garden let alone produces food for fussy eaters in some other continent who can pay for the sales pitch that what goes through their digestive system produces no CO2 or noxious gas.

Now without the smart move to cash in on lucrative grants and rebate (which soon was discontinued because it was unsustainable without increasing everyone else's power bills) those early adopter solar setups would still be in their boxes. I'm talking the 4Kw average 25KW rated systems that gave a grant on each watt of the 25000 watts of 61 cents. Thats SIX TIMES more grant than any other system that doesn't have full baseload capacity.

And that brings up a new term called "capacity factor" . Since it can go from 0 percent to 80 to 90 percent within minutes or hours; we must conclude that a 15% intermittent supply certainly can't instantaneously make up for all the periods of zero production; let alone the partial production periods etc. Who should give a shit about what capacity factors measure.

And what is the sense of showing that relying (or depending) on unavailable organic food for everyone in North America; let alone exports by the trainload is within the current capability of its promoters.

Keep your eyes on self interests; when someone isn't inviting competition in what has worked out really well for themselves. Everyone else is paying for it...and their agenda will become clear...and we will suffer the impacts disguised as how much worse it would have been had we not paid that $170+ per tonne carbon taxes;

I was going to not have the last word; but have now decided otherwise.

[Guest]

Not that much different than Vancouver where the Sun neglects to shine for months on end.

we get the added benefit of -30 to -40

[oneoff]

Try to disassociate what may apply to a unique early adopter position;.......as compared to what the rest of a province customers need and can afford. That challenge is fair because it comes at expense of all others.

Even take a look at the current rules of no SaskPower subsidy and 2 KW electricity injected entitles 1Kw returned within the next three years.

Please get back to us on your newly recalculated payout period; and the economics of the generated power being effectively half what it is now worth to every generator who may wish to replicate early adopter's experiences; but will find that the rules have been necessarily changed.

In summary; how does it feel to have your hand in everyone else's pocket?

[chuckChuck]

Alberta could lead Canada in wind and solar power by 2025, expert says

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/alberta-wind-and-solar-future-1.5728757 https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/alberta-wind-and-solar-future-1.5728757

"Growth in Alberta's renewable energy sector should continue its upward trend, experts say, with one forecast anticipating a surge of projects that could have the province poised to be the Canadian leader in utility-scale wind and solar capacity as early as 2025.

Rystad Energy tracks utility-scale wind and solar assets with at least one MWac (megawatt alternating current) in capacity. It forecasts that 83 per cent of the combined utility-scale wind and solar capacity built in Canada over the next five years will be in Alberta. That wouldn't include smaller renewable development such as residential rooftop solar."

"According to the data that Rystad tracks, Alberta's current renewable capacity includes 0.1 gigawatt (GW) of solar and 1.8 GW of wind. By 2025, it expects that to grow to 1.8 GW of solar and 6.5 GW of wind."

[Hamloc]

Try to disassociate what may apply to a unique early adopter position;.......as compared to what the rest of a province customers need and can afford. That challenge is fair because it comes at expense of all others.

Even take a look at the current rules of no SaskPower subsidy and 2 KW electricity injected entitles 1Kw returned within the next three years.

Please get back to us on your newly recalculated payout period; and the economics of the generated power being effectively half what it is now worth to every generator who may wish to replicate early adopter's experiences; but will find that the rules have been necessarily changed.

In summary; how does it feel to have your hand in everyone else's pocket?

If I understand you correctly Oneoff SaskPower no longer subsidizes solar installations and only pays you half for the power generated? Certainly would change the economics of on farm solar generation, I don’t think you would break even in the theoretical life span of 25 years for solar panels.

As for Chuck2 he has clearly stated in the past he has no problem with solar power subsidies, he would encourage it and would condemn Saskpower’s new policy.

[chuckChuck]

https://www.aeso.ca/assets/Uploads/AESO-Dispatchable-Renewables-Storage-Report-May2018.pdf https://www.aeso.ca/assets/Uploads/AESO-Dispatchable-Renewables-Storage-Report-May2018.pdf

Dispatchable Renewables and Energy Storage AESO

1.4 Assessing renewables integration requirementsThe AESO performed a comprehensive reliability and flexibility analysis to determine the impact of integrating 30 per cent intermittent renewable into the power system by 2030. This included conducting power system and market studies based on the AESO 2017 Long-term Transmission Plan (LTP) and the AESO 2017 Long-term Outlook (LTO), respectively. Two market simulation scenarios were studied to assess the future variability on the system as more intermittent renewables are integrated: a Moderate Coal-to-gas Conversion (2018−MCTG) scenario with 2,400 MW of existing coal converted to gas, and a High Coal-to-gas Conversion (2018−HCTG) scenario with 5,300 MW of existing coal converted to gas. The scenarios were modified from the LTO to incorporate higher wind generation, replacing some hydro and solar. Various power system studies were performed to assess overall transmission reliability, including system adequacy, voltage and system stability, and system inertia. The results confirmed that there were no material challenges forecast. Current transmission development plans identified in the LTPwill enable integration of the forecast level of renewables.

[Hamloc]

Interesting to note I must have been writing a response to Oneoff at the same time Chuck2 was typing and what a surprise in “typical Liberal fashion” his response wasn’t even related to what Oneoff pointed out, apparently Trudeau disease must be contagious on the left of center. Trudeau disease definition: inability to answer a direct question or respond to a question with a response that shows you understood the question.

[chuckChuck]

https://www.pembina.org/reports/renewable-energy--what-you-need-to-know.pdf https://www.pembina.org/reports/renewable-energy--what-you-need-to-know.pdf

Renewable energy — what you need to know


"What does renewable energy mean for utility bills?
In Alberta’s deregulated market, the system operator chooses electricity from the lowest-bidding power producers first, working its way up to more expensive bidders until demand is met. The most expensive generator chosen sets the hourly price at which all selected producers are paid. As renewable have no fuel costs, their producers bid at $0/MWh, and are selected first. Therefore, adding more renewables has the effect of drawing down electricity prices (Figure 5)"

[chuckChuck]

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41560-020-00695-4.epdf?sharing_token=4x0WoihtczizVbdTskgqPdRgN0jAj Wel9jnR3ZoTv0PKZskfNBvMm-4XFLE8lcn7vrdafttMwBs8prsl7zfeuMZZIi1u_0B0EQTqOIu8 fmmj1nRjwab02qZSEoi7NuzucdvENjM7JjGGFcIO2tJXp9Heop QoJz5pUquG--_UlRg%3D https://www.nature.com/articles/s41560-020-00695-4.epdf?sharing_token=4x0WoihtczizVbdTskgqPdRgN0jAj Wel9jnR3ZoTv0PKZskfNBvMm-4XFLE8lcn7vrdafttMwBs8prsl7zfeuMZZIi1u_0B0EQTqOIu8 fmmj1nRjwab02qZSEoi7NuzucdvENjM7JjGGFcIO2tJXp9Heop QoJz5pUquG--_UlRg%3D

A systematic review of the costs and impacts of integrating variable renewables into power grids Philip J. Heptonstalland Robert J. K. Gross

The impact of variable renewable energy (VRE) sources on an electricity system depends on technological characteristics, demand, regulatory practices and renewable resources. The costs of integrating wind or solar power into electricity networks have been debated for decades yet remain controversial and often misunderstood. Here we undertake a systematic review of the international evidence on the cost and impact of integrating wind and solar to provide policymakers with evidence to inform strategic choices about which technologies to support. We find a wide range of costs across the literature that depend largely on the price and availability of flexible system operation. Costs are small at low penetrations of VRE and can even be negative. Data are scarce at high penetrations, but show that the range widens. Nonetheless, VRE sources can be a key part of a least-cost route to decarbonization.