fertilizer to conservative's questions

[SASKFARMER]

Tom I was doing variable rate in 1984

Your not special

[Hamloc]

Other than in 2008 when has fertilizer prices ever been cheaper in spring than they were the past fall?

So the clueless retailers who were sitting with their fingers up their ass with no inventory and thought the upcoming Fertilizer shortages and strong demand for this upcoming spring was B.S this go around are to blame? Doesn't sound logical if they tell you every fall Fertilizer prices will be higher in the spring.

At the end of the day it's no sweat off the Fertilizer dealer's back if they now have to buy Urea at $1000.00/tonne and then turn around and sell it to you for $1200.00/tonne, they still make their margin regardless of their purchasing price. They know you'll pay.

Do you deal with the same Fertilizer retailer every year or do you bounce from one to the other every fall/spring?

I'm certainly not defending the Fertilizer dealers or I'm I happy that I and other farmers are having to pay these outrageous prices one year to the next. If you don't look after yourself quite frankly nobody gives a F uck if you as a farmer survive or go broke, most of your neighbors are waiting.

Normally in July and August I pay more attention to what is happening with fertilizer prices but this year with dryer weather I was more concerned about whether or not I would get a decent crop. I glanced at fertilizer prices and at the time thought they were a bit high. So unfortunately I waited, hoping they would come down. When I decided back at the first of October that prices weren’t coming down I started looking for prices and supply. 2 out of the 4 had supply and somewhat more reasonable prices, one could have supply in December, the fourth being a Nutrien dealer wouldn’t even quote a price. So I made a deal with the one supplier and he was in a hell of a hurry for me to pick up the product. He claimed he was concerned that other dealers in the network who had made sales but didn’t have the supply to back them up we’re going to come and haul out his product he had sold me. Whether that was true or not I have no idea. I was talking to the local Richardson rep on Friday and he said no supply now until February. One other thing, the person who sold me the fertilizer is now working for a seed company, I thought this was a weird development.

Forage the point of my story is today there are certainly supply issues. Whether there was back in August I don’t know. Should dealers have filled up then or for that matter booked supply? Absolutely! For that matter in hindsight I should have as well.

[TOM4CWB]

Normally in July and August I pay more attention to what is happening with fertilizer prices but this year with dryer weather I was more concerned about whether or not I would get a decent crop. I glanced at fertilizer prices and at the time thought they were a bit high. So unfortunately I waited, hoping they would come down. When I decided back at the first of October that prices weren’t coming down I started looking for prices and supply. 2 out of the 4 had supply and somewhat more reasonable prices, one could have supply in December, the fourth being a Nutrient dealer wouldn’t even quote a price. So I made a deal with the one supplier and he was in a hell of a hurry for me to pick up the product. He claimed he was concerned that other dealers in the network who had made sales but didn’t have the supply to back them up we’re going to come and haul out his product he had sold me. Whether that was true or not I have no idea. I was talking to the local Richardson rep on Friday and he said no supply now until February. One other thing, the person who sold me the fertilizer is now working for a seed company, I thought this was a weird development.

Forage the point of my story is today there are certainly supply issues. Whether there was back in August I don’t know. Should dealers have filled up then or for that matter booked supply? Absolutely! For that matter in hindsight I should have as well.

We find out who are our farm partners; working with us … nice to see some folks who are truly helpful today! Thank full for their transparency ! Same goes for grains buyers!

Cheers

[Guest]

we tried to buy in august , couldn't even get a price , depends on area , i guess

[Guest]

We have a steep learning curve... of how to show in a positive manner, how we can be responsible stewards of our soil health ... as the average Canadian consumer has been brainwashed into believing that organic grain production is 'sustainable' and 'healthy' for western Canadian agriculture.

Which causes me real fear when SF blows off steam saying we all will go broke as conventional grain growers... because we apply massive amounts of chemical fertilizers... which are 'uneconomic' 'unsustainable' because application rates used on the average western Canadian grain farm are obviously high and are being wasteful.

Pulse seed costs will come close to being double the cost for many farmers in 2022 than that of 2021 with just the pea seed costing well over $75/ac or over $100/ac... with treatments to prevent root fungus diseases [lower germ seed much more costly if 25-30% more needed than normal(2certified germination is as low as 70%) ]. A pulse reck is often the result of half the plant stand needed because of poor germ and low seeding rate... then weeds can take over...

2022 cereal seed costs will only be up 30% in many cases... because seed sizes are 30-50% smaller in the 2021 seed crop in dry areas... meaning less seed needed to get the same plants per sq ft. Most cereal germs/vigour well over 95%.]

High soluble P application can be reduced by 30-40%... and still have the same available P for the plant in the year of application... if seed placed and low salt formulation.

There will be big changes for some farmers... no doubt... high fertilizer cost reduces applied rates in short order... for those who are still using conventional traditional high rates and application methods that have been less than optimal in plant absorption efficiency. 20% increase in plant absorption efficiency = 20% savings... in 2022 that is big $$$!

How many Fert suppliers want to show you how to grow the same crop... with 25% less fertilizer SF?

Cheers

We double shoot with an old morris maxim , i have always felt we get better bang for our buck having seed 3/4" inch from fert. we spent years listening to the BG rep and others tell us that what we are doing doesn't work . left countless test strips over the years , never saw any seed burn , had a lot of good crops.
Sure didn't need test strips this year to tell that the mid row banded N never made it to the the plant, or vice versa . But my question is if a lot of this mid row banded fert never got used and it was this dry , a lot of MR banders maybe won't need any N?

[AlbertaFarmer5]

[QUOTE=Hamloc;520303 One other thing, the person who sold me the fertilizer is now working for a seed company, I thought this was a weird development.
[/QUOTE]
I'm finding that to be a common occurence lately. The labor market went from an employers market, to an employees market quite drastically in recent months. Lots of poaching, and moving place to place, and lots of old faces retiring all at once lately. At a far hgiher rate than I can remember, and happening across all industries. Get used to it.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

we tried to buy in august , couldn't even get a price , depends on area , i guess

Same thing here. The one place that could offer a price was for almost immediate pickup, with no price available to store it until later, which would have requiring hauling in the middle of harvest, with bins all full, no product and no price available elsewhere at the time. So I didn't get it bought until early Sept at a higher price, (and still no product available at other locations) but at least it was for December pick up, easier logistically. But I likely could have bought the bins and hired the truck on the difference between the August and September quote. And I likely would have if I had talked to the right person at the time, who was away, so I was dealing with a relatively new hire who didn't fully grasp the urgency that I was seeing.

[GDR]

Same thing here. The one place that could offer a price was for almost immediate pickup, with no price available to store it until later, which would have requiring hauling in the middle of harvest, with bins all full, no product and no price available elsewhere at the time. So I didn't get it bought until early Sept at a higher price, (and still no product available at other locations) but at least it was for December pick up, easier logistically. But I likely could have bought the bins and hired the truck on the difference between the August and September quote. And I likely would have if I had talked to the right person at the time, who was away, so I was dealing with a relatively new hire who didn't fully grasp the urgency that I was seeing.

I bought in September for November pickup, then they said December and now they are saying January. Hopefully supply comes through. Maybe should have said I was putting it in the ground in the fall, they kept the inventory for those guys, more than normal went in here. I dont take hay and pasture blends home, they still wont price for spring pickup, might not happen this year.

[jazz]

we tried to buy in august , couldn't even get a price , depends on area , i guess

Same here except early sept. Inquired several times and told no pricing. It was mid Oct before I could lock any up.

[TOM4CWB]

Tom I was doing variable rate in 1984

Your not special

Nov 26 you wrote....SF:

"5000 canola x 150 lbs S-15 at $1175 x 340 tons = $399,840.00
5000 Wheat x 125 Lbs S-10 at $1245 x 283 tons = $352,335.00"

And you expect me to believe these 'N' application rates are actual "variable rate" values... if that were so... you would be over 200N in areas... which would be at high risk of polluting groundwater significantly.

Your wheat Px is 16% @ 85bu/ac... growing the wheat varieties stated in pictures provided to us. 'Grin'

Cheers

[SASKFARMER]

Tom have you not got it yet I do math all the time some got early a lot haven’t it’s a example.

You did good for you now move on. My god good for you. Think. Lots didn’t get there crap insurance checks yet.

My god it’s an example.

[TOM4CWB]

Tom have you not got it yet I do math all the time some got early a lot haven’t it’s a example.

You did good for you now move on. My god good for you. Think. Lots didn’t get there crap insurance checks yet.

My god it’s an example.

This is about responsible application of crop nutrients... The fed wants to cut our supply by 30% by 2030. You sure make a good argument , a 'gift horse' to environmental groups and the liberals alike... that there is irresponsible application of crop nutrients right now... on your farm.


We have a really big hill hard to climb.... just to keep the crop nutrients we had available to our farms...that we applied in 2021...

We had a terrible drought year with high carry over nutrient going into 2022 for the majority of us in western Canada!!!.

Yet you stated we farmers are going bankrupt from the planned over application of un-needed nutrients.

Instead many farmers...will not spend significantly more on Fert in 2022... yet I am supposed to provide significant proof that the CDN Fed Liberal's nutrient plan is NOT responsible good public policy... when you just blew up our defence with a grumpy, horrible, example of irresponsible nutrient management!!!

Please Retract your unwise fert plan example... Please. Fighting [you] our own is useless unproductive energy...but now you [think it is clever] to force many of us farmers... to [spend a whole whack of time and energy] to fight against what you published here [on Agriville] in a grumpy notion of 'poor me' Im'm going bankrupt nutrient management false irrelevant unreliable... intentional mis-information.

Please wake up! This ain't funny!!!

Sincerely

[SASKFARMER]

I agree tommy your not that funny.


It was an example of a full fertilizer plan for max yield. In your little kneck of the woods maybe you cant grow a max yield crop?

I don't care it had nothing to do with the feds and their stupid starvation plan.

Farmers need to wake up and fight that at all costs.

But it was an example.

You have ever done math tom and come up with different scenarios.


Maybe you should.

The ending of the wheat board was a great plan but too bad someone didn't scratch on a paper out a few scenarios of what would happen without proper reporting or other things.

It was an example now move on.

[TOM4CWB]

Saskfarmer wrote;

"It was an example now move on."

Some of us are trying to actually fight the CDN Liberal Feds [passing laws with farm killing plans].... with resolutions and negotiations to modify restrictive policies like the '30% 2030 starvation plan for our farms.... and moratoriums to stop the destruction of wildlife habitats and removal of trees and hedgerows....

Some Folks [like you on here] bitterly complain about our Commodity group leadership...

Saying...that we don't do anything useful.

Yet with 'Friends like you" who needs enemies SaskFarmer.... Farmers can be their own worst enemies... you provided a good example of why this happens.

What resolutions and work are you doing... to stop the Liberal CDN Gov plan to starve your farm SaskFarmer in consultation with your Commodity Groups in SK?

You boast about your fleet of construction equipment bought to destroy wildlife and Climate refuge habitat... while providing ammunition to environmentalists to pass restrictive laws that will make farming an over regulated nightmare...simply because personal responsibility and self discipline are Not part of your farm environmental plan.

Cheers... the fight is lonely one Saskfarmer... thanks for not doing your share.

When the hot dry winds ravage your crops... because you destroyed the environmental protection with cats and trackhoes... [to rip up wetlands] then...you could complain to your self for magnifying the negative weather problems on all our farms!

[SASKFARMER]

Tom your way of being nice has achieved what.

You ****ed up the ending of the CWB without actually pushing for other measures to protect farmers

Most groups do **** all you know it.

Heck one group was spouting last summer the large crop going to be harvested this fall.

Farm groups arent working for farmers.