Insanity

[Landdownunder]

Yep.

[TOM4CWB]

Tom . Biden is no more socialist than you are. Taxpayers $ s going to corporations to make semi conductors
in the US. No universal Healthcare but money for them.
Maybe Trudeau believes on universal heathcare. Does that make every conservative that believes in it a socialist too?
Trudeau and Freeland blocking N imports to enrich Nutrien. It worked.
Sounds just like you and Harper banning seed ownership to enrich seed companies.

Apparently your ‘Nirvana’ doesn’t exist on our earth… Our purpose and prosperity… hope and happiness… are all in our spirits and souls.

Sad that our wonderful planet that God created for our pleasure and enjoyment… must be filled with fear and doomsday climate change manipulation that screams anti-Christ denial of the origin of life, freedom, through mercy, grace, and faith in our future through the Love of Jesus.

Climate change, evolution, the unending obsession to computerize everything… denies the faith hope and spiritual/ consciousness that is the true reason for humanity and our existence.

There is no hope… if we have no creative purpose or conscious spiritual reason to exist…

If being a drone in a purposeless universe is freedom… respectfully I believe evil has deceived humanity!!!

Blessings and Salutations

[WiltonRanch]

Apparently your ‘Nirvana’ doesn’t exist on our earth… Our purpose and prosperity… hope and happiness… are all in our spirits and souls.

Sad that our wonderful planet that God created for our pleasure and enjoyment… must be filled with fear and doomsday climate change manipulation that screams anti-Christ denial of the origin of life, freedom, through mercy, grace, and faith in our future through the Love of Jesus.

Climate change, evolution, the unending obsession to computerize everything… denies the faith hope and spiritual/ consciousness that is the true reason for humanity and our existence.

There is no hope… if we have no creative purpose or conscious spiritual reason to exist…

If being a drone in a purposeless universe is freedom… respectfully I believe evil has deceived humanity!!!

Blessings and Salutations

I’m farthest from being a bible puncher but totally agree with this. Part of being human. Nilhists can screw themselves into the nothingness they believe in.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Good point. Chinas foothold on manufacturing is coming to an end to be replaced by automated domestic manufacturing. China will still make stuff but workforce is aging out too. Corporations hold a gun to the heads of governments with the fear they’ll move out for fear of higher tax. China was giving corps tax breaks in exchange for intellectual property and employment for the masses. Problem is China has zilch for revenue vs gdp compared to rest of high gdp nations. It’s not sustainable nor is taxing the piss out of middle class and small business while letting corps get away and having government redistribute money back to the people. I don’t know what the magic bullet but probably a balanced pragmatic approach is the next best thing. Far as people being put out of work by automation I think is a benefit as the work force is shrinking as we age out and don’t replace ourselves. I tell my kids to get on the tech thing no matter what industry they choose to become involved with. Even the automation seen in the oilfield the last 8 years is unprecedented. They’re cutting up the old rigs in favour of newer ones which require less manpower. Wells with remote monitoring so an operator can handle 4 times the wells my grandfather pumped in the 60’s. In the next 50 years demand for food worldwide will shrink as old people eat less. It’s just geopolitics and desertification will shift production demand to stable and fertile regions.

Now here is someone who gets it. I try hard to sympathize with sawfly's point of view, he is after all one of the most reasonable posters on the left end of the spectrum on this site.but I think his political ideologies blind him to the realities of the world we live in today.

[jazz]

I think sawfly needs some assistance with definitions.

Social programs are different than socialism. Social programs are a wealth distribution that we can all benefit from, such as health care, or welfare or EI etc.

Socialism is robbing from one group who is more productive and handing it out to others who arent, example Carbon tax.

And marxism is taking from one group to give to another and then destroying their livelihood in the process ex climate change or covid.

[agstar77]

I think sawfly needs some assistance with definitions.

Social programs are different than socialism. Social programs are a wealth distribution that we can all benefit from, such as health care, or welfare or EI etc.

Socialism is robbing from one group who is more productive and handing it out to others who arent, example Carbon tax.

And marxism is taking from one group to give to another and then destroying their livelihood in the process ex climate change or covid.

You mean Marx was into climate change and covid. Wow really ahead of his time L.O.l. Any more dumb statements?

[blueversi]

You mean Marx was into climate change and covid. Wow really ahead of his time L.O.l. Any more dumb statements?

Ex is short for example just so you know. He was giving examples of current Marxist pet projects there IQ77.

[jazz]

You mean Marx was into climate change and covid. Wow really ahead of his time L.O.l. Any more dumb statements?

Guess I have to give a more relevant example for you. How about CWB and the NEP. Close to Marxism as you can get.

Marxists are always looking for some thing to bring in their centrally planned utopia. That’s why they drool over climate change and covid mandates.

[sawfly1]

Tom . I do not know what brought on the sermon. And just to let you know , that kind of stuff is wasted on me anyway.
Not one of the flock , so to speak.
I got you had no comeback as soon as you went there.

And jazz , you can't change the definition of things just to suit your political stripe.
Universal health care is socialist.
Ask any American

It's like the American farm programs.
Talk about a redistribution of other people's money. But it us only socialism if someone else benefits.

[jensend]

As soon as you have public roads or fire departments or police forces or a publicly funded military you have socialism. It's called a mixed economy. Try to find a country that doesn't have a mixed economy.

[WiltonRanch]

Tom . I do not know what brought on the sermon. And just to let you know , that kind of stuff is wasted on me anyway.
Not one of the flock , so to speak.
I got you had no comeback as soon as you went there.

And jazz , you can't change the definition of things just to suit your political stripe.
Universal health care is socialist.
Ask any American

It's like the American farm programs.
Talk about a redistribution of other people's money. But it us only socialism if someone else benefits.

You bet social programs and money redistribution are socialist. Heck all out social programs were resultant of efforts by the Progressives and later ccf. It is a balancing act though as to how much involvement the government should have in our economy and daily lives before it is detrimental as being laissez faire. We can all agree we wouldn’t want it like the 1800’s but big government or big businesses calling all the shots is not good. What seems apparent now is both are calling the shots at the same time. Entrepreneurship and an environment which curries opportunities for small businesses and the individual for upward mobility is what makes a democracy whole. Once you create an environment that quashes that spirit your country is in decline.

[furrowtickler]

You bet social programs and money redistribution are socialist. Heck all out social programs were resultant of efforts by the Progressives and later ccf. It is a balancing act though as to how much involvement the government should have in our economy and daily lives before it is detrimental as being laissez faire. We can all agree we wouldn’t want it like the 1800’s but big government or big businesses calling all the shots is not good. What seems apparent now is both are calling the shots at the same time. Entrepreneurship and an environment which curries opportunities for small businesses and the individual for upward mobility is what makes a democracy whole. Once you create an environment that quashes that spirit your country is in decline.

Very well said and that’s the path we are on currently and fast

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Very well said and that’s the path we are on currently and fast

Not that anyone actually listens to me, but one conundrum I think about a lot, is what economic system and taxation system would work best to eliminate the above mentioned problems.
To somehow ensure equality of opportunity, while accepting that equality of outcome is impossible. Something that avoids concentration of wealth down through generations of dynasties, without destroying the incentive of the first end of each successive generation.
Fund social programs that are adequate to keep people from ending up destitute, without destroying the incentive to be productive.
Democratic decision-making, without the inevitable decline into buying votes with other people's money.
A tax structure which encourages entrepreneurship and small businesses without devolving into crony capitalism, and which doesn't unjustly punish those who are exceptionally ambitious and innovative and grow into large businesses.

Making political terms long enough that they can actually Bear the fruit of their positive policy choices, instead of being punished for sound economic policies which result in short-term pain for long-term gain. Without simultaneously resulting in the inevitable corruption from being in office too long.

The ability to use debt and interest rates and taxes as a tool to encourage Capital to go into productive assets, and discourage it from creating bubbles in unproductive assets.
Somehow encourage personal responsibility at all levels. But still have the safety net to catch those who fall through the cracks.

On the economic end, I think most of those goals could be accomplished with targeted flexible consumption based taxes along with estate taxes and inheritance taxes as opposed to blanket income taxes and corporate taxes. And otherwise getting government out of the business of business.

Fixing the political system of course, is not nearly as simple.

[jazz]

As soon as you have public roads or fire departments or police forces or a publicly funded military you have socialism. It's called a mixed economy. Try to find a country that doesn't have a mixed economy.

My roads and rail arent socialist. They have universal access so anyone can use them. Thats a social program.

Fire, police and military protect all canadians rich and poor.

But did every person in Canada get the same climate action rebate.

See the difference. Govt picking winners and punishing losers with our tax money and regulations. Thats some straight up marxist BS.

[dmlfarmer]

You bet social programs and money redistribution are socialist. Heck all out social programs were resultant of efforts by the Progressives and later ccf. It is a balancing act though as to how much involvement the government should have in our economy and daily lives before it is detrimental as being laissez faire. We can all agree we wouldn’t want it like the 1800’s but big government or big businesses calling all the shots is not good. What seems apparent now is both are calling the shots at the same time. Entrepreneurship and an environment which curries opportunities for small businesses and the individual for upward mobility is what makes a democracy whole. Once you create an environment that quashes that spirit your country is in decline.

Big business and government are not competing for control, they are collaborating! Who has the governments ear, the average Canadian or big business and their paid lobbyists? And history shows right wing governments are just as bad at catering to big business as left wing governments if not more so