NFU #s ???

[TOM4CWB]

Cowman,

VERY interesting theology!

"You are not special...you are just another poor soul trying to get through this "vail of tears"?"

I have faith enough to believe... every single person on this little blue planet... third from the sun... was/is made a very special person. Everyone is a true miracle, and is worthy of being given the right of being a HUMAN BEING.

OUR future prosperity, that of my family, my community, and my Country hangs on this very fact. The belief that every single person has a free will, with the freedom of spirit, and can decide NOW where they intend to exist after the big crossover in existance (DEATH).

I MUST fight for Truth and Rightousness... my faith demands this... and our very existance depends upon taking a stand... above all else stand!

"FOR EVIL to Prevail... all it takes if Good People to do Nothing."

Strange how you consider being focused... and knowing where our faith and relationship with this planet and our creation clearly leads... is seen as arrogance?

If there is a "vail of tears"... as for me and my house... they will be tears of Joy! This is the point of our very existance.

I believe the thousands upon thousands who died to keep Canada free... is past wars, law enforcment, protective services, and public service...

That gave up so much to see our country blossom into a blessed land flowing with milk and honey... deserve no less from me.... what about you Cowman?

God Bless Canada!

[cowman]

TOM: No I don't believe I owe this country anything more than what they gouge out of me at tax time! I'm a western seperatist. Both my parents were western seperatists.
What I was trying to point out is this: This plebicite is little more than a popularity poll? When you imply because you are part of the "20% that grow 80%" that you should have a bigger share of the vote...that does not go over well?
Instead point out how everyone can benifit from the "choice" to market? Or do you believe that?
If you read my posts you know I do not support a single desk monopoly in any way? Personally I would support scrapping the whole thing and bulldozing the building in Winnipeg!
But I also realize some farmers want the option to sell through the CWB. I believe there should be a choice...sell on the open market if you choose, sell through the CWB if that works for you.
Mr. Strahl has stated very clearly, if the single desk goes...there will still be a CWB? It isn't going to cease to exist...that is the message you need to get out there?
Silverback: Somehow you interpretted my comments that I support the CWB! Believe me I do not. I personally have never grown anything for the CWB, nor has my tenant! My father grew his last CWB wheat crop in 1963...at which time he vowed he would never sell the thieves another bushel...and he did not.

[TOM4CWB]

Cowman,

My faith and cultural tradition is to respect everyone and our right to own property... and our right to vote on this issue. I to believe if the folks who "need" the CWB, want to use the CWB... then if the CWB will respect my farm assets and not take property they don't own...
as they did before Goodale corrupted them in 1993...
or as Minister Strahl has asked them to do today...
like Goodale and Alcock asked them to do in recent past years...
and the Western Grain Marketing Panel Report recommeneded they do 10 years ago...

If the CWB openly competes and buys grain like everyone must by law do... I will gladly support the CWB buying and marketing any grain or product they want to!

[agstar77]

Cowman, and you actually believe a politician!! The Con/Reform said they would not abolish income trusts either. The reform party grew out of the CF 18 debacle and now seeks to repeat it with the C17. Yeah we will believe them when pigs fly!!

[mustardman]

Silverback there is a big difference between the monopoly in the cattle business and the CWB.
The CWB is the only seller. Versus
The monopoly in cattle being the Only buyer !!

[silverback]

So you are saying the cwb is not the "buyer" of the stuff grown on my land?

I'm not sure I follow that. I grow it, ship it through them, they tell me what it's worth, and give me a cheque.

Is that not the same as buying?

Or are you simply stating that in reality it is their grain to begin with so they are the seller and I am just the employee who takes all the risk?

I guess I should be grateful for all the great work they are providing me with this year.

[kamichel]

silverback, the CWB is not a grain buyer, they are a grain seller. We get what they offer us. Sure they now offer different options but until they have to purchase our grain under competition they should only be considered sellers. Us farmers get what is left over less what goes into the contingency fund.

[Burbert]

Tom4CWB Statistics are for those persons that have a really weak small mind, lets count something, aaah 1,2,3,4, this is working really good, its a modern way of doing things. Just like 0 tolerance, a no brainer lets get tough, crack down, throw somebody in jail, fight a war against small farmers (Oops I sound like a Conservative Red neck). 20% producing 80% of the grain, is just plain bunk. There is a heck of a lot more to the farm and farm life than a fat bank account, or aren't you a good steward of the land. No lets mine it for all its worth, I say! Just remember, we all were or are small beginning farmers at some point. Remember your roots for gosh sakes, I don't want to be a land baron! Guess that makes me a commie or some such ting.

[parsley]

A note to mustardman and kamichel
about the CWB buying/selling grain:


1. The CWB is a buyer of farmer grain.

2. The CWB only sells CWB-owned grain.

Every one who does a "buyback" knows this all too well. The CWB buys grain from the farmer. There is a legal tranfer of ownership of the grain from the farmer to the CWB.

A farmer doing a buyback to sell into the USA has to go through 3 legal transfers of ownership of the grain he's shipping:

1. Robert legally sells his grain to the CWB, and there is a legal transfer of ownership, to the CWB.
Sometimes Robert retains possession.
Legal Ownership Transfer #1

2. Robert BUYS the grain back from the CWB(they own it, remember!), and the CWB legally transfers the ownership to Robert.
Legal Ownership Transfer #2

3. Robert sells the purchased CWB grain to North Dakota Elevator, and transfers ownership to ND Elevator
Legal Ownership Transfer #3

Legal ownership is very important.

Ownership and possession are very different in the eyes of the law. As farmers well know, you can own a bin and not possess it. You can possess a bin and not own it.

Parsley

[cowman]

TOM: How does it help your cause to create a division in the minds of people? To say things like the "20%" should make the decisions? Or that young progressive big farmers should have a greater say? You are implying that the other 80% of supposedly old backwards small farmers shouldn't have a say?
Do you see how that devides people?
My advice to you is never go into politics...because 20% of the electorate will never get you in office! Your arguments are actually helping the single desk side win this plebicite. Focus on the plusses of "choice" for everyone? Its like I told Cotton...you catch a lot more flies with honey than vinegar.

[stubblejumper]

Tom now I see why less than 200 people voted for you.

[AdamSmith]

So gentlemen, the issue as I see it is that these two groups of farmers seem to have different needs and goals, yet we continue to make decisions (on policy) as if there is no difference between them. This leads to conflict which no one wants to touch with a ten foot pole. But the conflict continues and then when someone (governments) does make a decision they do a head count and it almost always sides with the rural lifestylers and rarely sides with the rural businessers. In fact I’ve witnessed in municipal politics decisions that have been made so as to cause deliberate harm to the large farmers and any person looking on objectively could see that. The issue of drainage has become so contentious around here that if you want to drain you follow the policy of “It’s easier to apologize after the fact than to follow the rules and apply for a permit” Because applying for a permit is the equivalent of being told you can’t drain.

There has been some discussion here about rural depopulation, if the truth be known rural depopulation has more to do with “The kids are more attracted to the big lights and have no internal calling for the farm”. Some of the most prosperous farmers in our area will have auction sales because the kids interests and career choices took them away. This is why we have large farms. I don’t know of one farmer who would get in the way of a family transfer of land, but when there is no one there to take it over, it’s sold or rented to the highest bidder and the highest bidder is usually the larger farmer who has the larger resources behind him. Business trumps lifestyle every time here.

I had an interesting conversation with my local tire shop owner. I needed to replace a couple of tires on my grain trailer after my brakes froze and I dragged them around a little to long before I saw what was happening. He was telling me about another farmer who was just in and this guy was bemoaning the fact that there are no young people farming anymore. The tire guy pointed out that he’s not surprised at all because the way he saw it, if as a young person all you ever heard about farming from your parents and other area farmers was how bad things were, and that you can’t make money or your getting screwed by everyone, no sane person would want to farm. Their only goal would be to get out and as quick as possible.

Our children see things that we sometimes don’t see. I will admit that my wife and I live a fairly rich lifestyle. We wear designer jeans and drink wine at supper. We travel well. In fact on Friday we leave for two weeks in Jamaica. We’ll take the kids skiing in Banff in March, we spend a lot of time enjoying life and not worrying to much about how much all of it costs. My priorities are enjoy life and I’ve let my kids know that.

Now I don’t know if either of my boys will farm but I want them to see, day in and day out that you can achieve and enjoy the upper middle class lifestyle from the farm. That lifestyle is not just achieved in the city. In fact if you can achieve it from the farm you have the best lifestyle available.

So if I come across as only for the big farmers well maybe I am, but it’s only because it’s my strong opinion that the “woe is me” farmer attitude and the envious “must be nice” attitude does nothing but drive people away. Portray success and celebrate success and you present a much more attractive choice to the next generation.

[cowman]

The only thing I want to know is this from TOM? Hey TOM do you wear designer jeans and booze it up at dinner? Do you too live the life of Riley?
Now I only ask that because I like to know what kind of guy runs for a seat on the CWB? Is that the kind of guy you are? Is all the humility about being religious and caring about your fellow man, just a fraud?
Designer jeans...give me a break!LOL

[grassfarmer]

Cowman you old cynic,don't you know you've made it when you can afford designer jeans?

[wilagro]

The patches on my jeans all have designs on them.