Harper miscalculates

[AdamSmith]

cotton,

when you see an eastbound train and a westbound train on the same track, heading towards one another at full speed,

you just stand there and watch in amazement

there is nothing you can do except
wait for the carnage to happen and think about what it will be like to tell your grandchildre you were there and watch it all happen.

Have I thought about your scenerio? Yup. And about a hundred other plausable scenerions. Not one of them turns out very good for the people of Canada.

Everyone says it's perfectly constitutional for the opposition to form a gov't after a vote of no confidence. But I think there is a reason why it has only been attempted once. It's because the long term ramifications on the parties that go along with it are very very undesirable. I truly do believe that is exactly what will result here.

Trudeau's NEP will be considered a minor nuisance to the west compared to the way the west will react to this gov't takeover by the libs and dippers.

The Libs chances of ever forming a national majority will be nil for the next fifty years, if as you say the west seperates before then.

[AdamSmith]

oops should read

if as you say the west hasn't seperated before then.

[chuckChuck]

Several posts here and elsewhere have been critical of public funding of the political parties. At 1.95 per vote it is peanuts. Jean Chretian was the one who put the brakes on corporate and union donations and brought in the $1000 per individual maximum. Chretian should have went further and put a cap on campaign spending. Public funding is the fairest way of fundraising. Otherwise you end up with a system where those with more money have more influence which is very undemocratic. Of course many Conservatives would prefer corporations having more influence.

[Zaphod]

That last comment is pure baloney. Donation limits put an end to the issue of corporate financing of campaigns. Donations are the best indicator of the health of a party. If the libs and dippers can't get donations, they should take it as a signal of their popularity and fix their problems. It's time for them to get out of the public trough.

[bucket]

Sometimes you have to lose a battle to win the war. Harper's only mistake was to give the opposition another week. I think Canadians are smart enough to see this is about public funding of political parties and they would boot the liberals and ndp hard. Harper is going to get his majority. Either way, on this one, the liberals are not gaining support.

[cottonpicken]

Alls i see is fragmentation,i cant imagine anyone ever getting a majority.


This economic thing is NOT going to drive quebec and ontario voters into the arms of the conservatives.

A liberal minority with ignataweirdo is very real.

[agstar77]

This all goes back to the way the Cons won the election, or at least gained the most seats. They continually hammerd away at Dionne calling him weak and ineffective, even before the election was called. They used their accumulated war chest to mock him, not put forward their own positive agenda. Even if they were right in their opinion, it set the stage for what has transpired. They expect the opposition to support them after such a bitter election. Had they been concilliatory in there new parliament and met with the opposition to discuss government actions to allleviate the economic crisis. Instead they poked the opposition in the eye with a sharp stick. Do you think any intelligent person thinks that was good governance? The Cons will launch another series of attack ads to try to discredit the opposition. It will serve to further divide the country. If Harper wants to keep power , he should bite the bullet admit they acted without enough thought and ask the opposition to help them come up with a better plan. Otherwise he will go down as another one term Prime Minister.

[Fransisco]

Hey Agstar are you done your christmas shopping yet?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSP_i9MI9NU

[wilagro]

Fransisco: And where is Harper's "commemorative" plate to be found? Perhaps in the bottom of a p*** pot.

[AdamSmith]

public funding of political parties have weakend our democracy. It has allowed public subsidization of Quebec seperation, it has kept the liberal party from being grounded to the people.

Take this attepted coup, it wasn't coming from some great groundswell from the people, it originated in the minds of Chretien and Broadbent and in the backrooms of stale festering ivory towers of Liberaldom.

Harpers idea of getting all parties off the public tit comes from the people who despise the idea of having their tax dollars going to seperatists and other unsavory creatures who do not speak for them and never will.

The product(s) offered by political parties are ideas. And I and probably 90% of all other Canadians believe Quebec seperation and for that matter western seperation are BAD ideas that are Bad for the country. Yet we give those (the Bloc) money to continue to advance that idea and advance disunity amoungst Canadians.

Now chuckchuck give me one, just one, argument that shows me I'm wrong.

And really is too much to ask for people who strongly support an idea or a cause or a party to actually put their money where their mouths are and fund it.

Ask not what the counrty can do for you but ask what can you do for your country. JFK words are just as relevent today as they were in 1961, maybe even more so.

But chuckchuck your advocating the exact opposite, you want the counrty built on the idea that it's nobel to be a freeloader. Self reliance is evil and must be mocked and reviled.

We're talking ten bucks or twenty bucks here. If a person can't even bother to part with that they really need to quit complaining. And I don't care who you are and what your financial condition is. Donating to a political party is not onerous.

Obama raised over $600 million and the average donation was $86 bucks.

These three who flew over the coo coo's nest are exactly what is wrong with our democracy.

Political party finacing based on voluntary donations only takes the power away from the backrooms and ivory towers and gives the power back to the citizens where it belongs.

[agstar77]

A.S. , one problem with your reasoning. Harper did not get a Majority, he govern's at the pleasure of Parliament.

[AdamSmith]

Agstar, I'm talking about a basic principle here, not about the current politics of the issue.

whether it be 2008, 2018 or 3008 the principle of voluntary contibutions only is sound.

Your debating whether Harper was overly opportunist, I don't know that, maybe he was but I do know the basis of the principle is good for democracy.

But with perpetual minorities we can never look beyong six months. And that is a serious problem for this country and I blame the Bloc 100% for that.