Property Rights in A Market Economy

[checking]

It was your orb that tossed family farms as losing freehold mineral titles up in the air to the Sask. government over non-payment of mineral fees. I'd like to know what the fee amounted to, and how many farm families lost titles to this great socialist adventure? I know the government must have failed to send their bill to this family farm, so Tommy if you're listening I still have my mineral title. I owe you one, buddy! In the 1950's there were a number of, for lack of a better word, scam artists who traversed the province signing up as many freehold mineral owners as they could under various schemes. Some sent out an undivided 1/5 interest trust certificate to the original 100% owner, 60% went into the trust company from which the mineral participants would share a common percentage based on acres committed, and 20% was the fee for the scheme organizer. There were so many various differences up to and including a 100% forfeiture with the original owner being left with a small gross royalty override and no say in the development scheme. A blight is left on the greatest Canadian ever's record for not voiding this theft, thereby protecting the Saskatchewan family farms.

[checking]

Oh! Congratulations on being a grandmother.

[parsley]

Only governments can tax. And we were talking about taxation, rememeber?

The 1944 Mineral Taxation Act was passed by the Government of Sask. Land/property taxes are also examples of legislated extractions. Imperial Oil, for example, cannot pass legislation to tax you.

If you owned mineral rights, Tommy Douglas either got paid, or he took your mineral rights and put them into the Crown. My neighbors lost their mineral rights for non-payment.

I would suggest if you would like you would like to be better informed about taxation, the amounts collected, the Mineral Tax Act, and Tommy Douglas' vision, that you dedicate a little time to your self-education. Novel idea, I'm sure. I meant for you to click on checking's link, not snap your fingers. Pars

[wilagro]

Alberta had a similar law on mineral rights and it was finally withdrawn. My father darned near lost his mineral rights because of it before it was withdrawn. My younger brother who inherited the farm still has the rights to the natural gas but until they develop the gas field, he gets zip and after he is gone it will probably be developed...that's the way things work sometimes.

[parsley]

wilagto, how nice, we haven't spoken in awhile. Do you know how much the mineral taxes were in Alberta? I have all the old Sask taxes, with the amounts on them, but I've not had time to access them. Romance novels take time. LOL Pars

[pilpilsner]

While were at it lets ponder the implications of former and present conservative governments budjet short falls and what they will/have done to taxes.

Paint 'em all black and chuck a few feathers on them.

[parsley]

I haven't heard that expression for some time.

Do you want to comment on the budget just passed in Saskatchewan?

[pilpilsner]

You mean the largest one ever?

[checking]

Was the $0.10 an acre, $16.00/quarter, that Imperial Oil paid farmers, not enough to pay Tommy's taxes? Just checking! Blood pressure, blood pressure, blood pressure - no, still 120/80!!!

[checking]

Chuckchuck, your posts were really what I wanted to discuss. I don't know your province, but you seem to suggest that you've had some bad experiences with oil companies. As a surface owner, you have more power than what you've indicated, provided you didn't give them away for some short term gain through a bit of seismic money. In Saskatchewan, as a surface right's owner you have total control over the granting of oil company access to seismic gathering. ------------------For 40 years this farm was not the least interested in oil development, even those a succession of companies wanted to explore, because we determined the technology and infrastructure wasn't available to handle sour gas (H2S). It is sickening to be caught in the prevailing winds of a battery site that vents to atmosphere off its tanks that never reaches a flare stack. Vapor recovery systems off production tanks that are plumbed to flare stacks are an absolute minimum that you need to insist on from any oil company that comes a courting. The best you want to strive for is pipelining to an area gasplant where production gas and tank vapor gas can all be process utilized. ---------------------------I'm in an area where it is absolutely essential to have seismic data to determine formation tops and the existance of potential oil trap structures. This farm, although it owns less than 5% of the mineral rights on its land base, turned down all offers for seismic work. Give up your seismic rights, before you have an invited kitchen table discussion with the head office personnel who have the final say for their oil company on what you expect out of them and what their plans are on your land, and you will have a potential for a farming lifetime of grief. Do it right and we've found that the seven oil companies that are on our lands will bend over backwards to keep a smooth working relationship.

[wilagro]

parsley: No, I don't remember what the mineral rights tax was. That was a long time ago and my father's been long gone as well. My brother can't sell the rights that he inherited...our !@#$% AB government made darned sure of that. It is even a wonder that my brother was able to inherit the rights.

If I find out any pertinent details, I will let you know.

Cheers

[checking]

Come on Avers, please tell me what you know about your father's or your grandfather's confiscated mineral titles that were taken over by the 1944 Saskatchewan government Mineral Tax Act for failure to pay the legislative rate. Grandmother won't post it here, even though she suggested what was an interesting speculation (verification). I'd like not to hear that some dead guy told some other dead guy that this happened, so it must be true. You don't have to go to grandmother's casino site in Las Vegas by touching a clicky blue thing when the Regina casino is where it was first posted.