How much is fair mark up on crop inputs

[Fransisco]

Here are some other examples of the wonders of democracy to go with the Socrates one.

Hitler was elected.

Slavery was developed to satisfy the demands of the white majority in America.

An important example comes from the French Revolution known to history as the "Reign of Terror"--i.e., the period of Jacobin dictatorial rule from June 2, 1793, to June 27, 1794.


There's a line from the movie "The Patriot" that hits the nail on the head. As colonists were debating whether to impose a tax to raise a militia and fight the British, Mel Gibson's character says,

"Why should I trade one tyrant 3000 miles away for 3000 tyrants one mile away? An elected legislature can trample a man's rights as easily as a King can."

And here is a great quote from H.L. Mencken: <b>"Democracy is a form of worship. It is the worship of jackals by jackasses."</b>

[Fransisco]

There is also a great movie I saw the other day "Sophie Scholl: The Last Days" about a courageous young German girl who stood up to the Nazi's and paid a terrible price for daring to go against the will of the majority.

http://www.sophieschollmovie.com/

tower you remind me of the judge in the movie.

[AdamSmith]

Tower, you seem to confuse government with business. But I guess it's Saturday and the cwb is now "a government unto itself"

Yesterday was Friday and it was "a business". Silly me!

And speaking of spitting in the face of democracy what about the 62% that voted to end the cwb's monopoly on barley?

Tower this sentence you wrote kinda caught my attention.

The logic that as used to establish our board district boundaries....

You used the words "our board" in the personal. As in "our house" or "our company"

Probably just your way of writing, but it could also indicate you too are a CWB Director and as such would say "our board". I know others think your Vader and we know Vader is Rod Flaman and Flaman is a Director and you do write and sound almost exactly like Vader,

but it's probably just me reading things into something that really isn't there, but on the other hand...

[Fransisco]

Adam I think its probably too much to expect board supporters like tower to live by their own principles. That would take a sense of honour and decency not to mention consistency. Three attributes that are not conducive to maintaining the 'all powerful board'.

[highwayman]

tower
Why don't you and your horsemen go back to Communist China where I am sure you will feel right at home and let us know what you see there. In the meantime the rest of us will move forward into the 21st century with individual freedom and prosperity.

[parsley]

tower, When you make a statement like this:


"I've seen some pretty good social activists and protesters go to jail for reasons that I though were a lot better than trying to make an end run around the wheat board.

I have no sympathy there.

You have the option of trying to get elected in a relatively small election process and trying to change things from within."

It means you are a conniving, greedy bully.

I want you to remember Ghandi. The British set up a salt tax in India. If you wanted to get salt from the ocean, you had to pay the arbitrary tax.

There was no use negotiating.

There was no use putting a few Indians on a bloody committee.

The ONLY thing that changed the British taxation was when thousands of Indians broke the law. Flagrantly. They ran the salt-tax border.

And the British folded their tents and withdrew the fee/requirement.

It is the only way to deal with the likes of you, tower. A bully. A greedy bully. A conniving greedy bully. Wanting money.Greed.

Hopefully you get the message.

Parsley

[mustardman]

One way to fix our grain prices- lobby your M.P to raise the initial price.
Apparently a month and a half ago they were asked to do so by CWB. This happened last year as well,the
feds
refused to move for 2 months on price increase.
Forget the PARTISAN POLITICS fellows,because the last time I looked we as farmers do not have Voting power by Numbers.
If the conservatives are doing something wrong tell them. Don't blindly follow ,thinking they
will look out for you because it aint gonna happen. We are a small small group. Lobby lobby lobby like the railroad the chem companies the pharmaceuticals etc etc .

[tower]

chaffmeister, I did get to the quorum site, it's the same study you referred me to last month, with the comment that grain multinationals make more money handling board grain than non-board. That's a cute thing to say.

define handling. If you don't include the actual buying and selling of the commodity in the definition you have a viable argument. The point is that when the grain trading takes place the buying low and selling high to consumers the multinationals can afford to take a loss in their shipping departments because their markup is so high when they sell it doesn't matter..

You weren't trying to suggest that handling is the only place where the companies make their money or that they make less overall on commodities that they market themselves. were you?

As a broker, maybe you could provide us with information that would back that one up.

[tower]

highwayman, fransisco, AdamSmith, et al one of the prerequisites of a good democracy is that there is a need for well based debate.

Perhaps the strength of the majority is not just in the brute strength of higher numbers participating on the majority side but also in the increased ability to debate and come up with superior solutions, you know, two heads are better than one.

Adam you seem to think that a democratically run business is an oxymoron, I don't understand that anymore than that old right wing crap about government should be run like a business.

[tower]

mustardman, sounds like good advice to me. Lobby like the farm depends on it.

I wasn't aware that the board has to apply to the conservatives or the liberals in order to raise the initial price. Can you show me to the relevant legal site? Or explain where the justification comes from?

Thanks, Tower

[silverback]

Tower,

Let's try this. Please state for the record whether you think that a farmers own production actually belongs to him or whether it belongs to the cwb.

Also, should all canadian grain farmers be forced to market their grain the way that we do in the designated area?

Simple.

[parsley]

tower,

You state lobbying is effective. Carry it a step further.

Every year, the CWB negotiates a handing agreement with the companies and mutlinationals, clearly setting out what "cut" will be sliced off the farmers' profits for services rendered.

This document is the most valuable Board grains agreement that the companies have in hand! And the CWB negotiates it!


By your inference, then, farmers need to lobby the CWB ITSELF to make a better deal on behalf of farmers, since the companies are making excessive money on the deals now in place.

ONLY the CWB is able to make the negotiation on Board grains.


Is this the kind of lobbying you are e-talking about? Would you help advocate a lower-rate negotiation?

Parsley

[charliep]

Does the government have to approve any changes to initial payments? Yes. Has to be approved by order in council (those words again). Why? Because taxpayers guarantee initial payments. Where power comes from? See CWB act.

[Fransisco]

It's competition that is a prerequisite for a healthy economy. Good grief, we're talking about how to get the best returns for our wheat here not how to run a country. When it comes to economics differences of opinion fight it out in the marketplace not a polling station.

Frankly their is nothing in this world more democratic than the free market in action.

And as long as you keep talking about putting your neighbors in jail for having a diffent opinion than yours on how to market their grain you are advocating the use of force for your own ends. You are still a bully.

[TOM4CWB]

Tower,

That was an interesting turn!

"...old right wing crap about government should be run like a business"

How else Should the PM and Finance Minister manage a half a $trillion?

Would you not run a balanced budget?