Carbon turned into fertilizer

[SASKFARMER3]

Just a question has any one seen the system the guy from Alberta is selling that takes your c02 from your tractor engine and cools it then adds this cooled product to your air stream into the soil.
Thus reducing emissions and getting some fert bang on the side.
Has any one seen his results or heard of this?

[FarmRanger]

You're joking, right?

[SASKFARMER3]

No I hate to say it their was a meeting locally in Saskatchewan how you take your exhaust cool it down and then send this into your airstream with the seed. But big cost. with promise of sending money back from carbon off sets purchased by people in the city.
Still sounds funny but always good to listen and learn and take something out of it.
But still want to know if anyone farms by this guy and what his crops look like with little to no fertilizer use.

[seedsman]

I've seen this written up in at least 2 farm papers. Seems the biggest problem was getting the exhaust cooled enough so that it didn't melt some of the hoses on the air drill. Can't remember many more details

[Jay-mo]

I actually heard their presentation at the Man-Dak zero-till conference in February. I talked to a couple of the fellas that developed the system and it sounds like its still very much in the development stage. I cant remember the exact numbers but to get involved i think costs roughly 30-40G which gets you the "technology" and would cover the equipment and support required to get everything functioning properly.
One producer I talked to that used the system last year farms 5000 acres did not put any N in the ground but applied three applications of 5lbs N foliarly with good success apparently.
I think its actually quite promising from many angles. At this point i'm not ready to make the leap but I am definetly watching with interest.

[FarmRanger]

Ok, I’m intrigued.

Someone takes exhaust - C02, H20, residual unburned fuel and air - pumps this mixture into the ground and somehow this replaces nitrogen fertilizer? The only source of nitrogen possible from this mix would be the nitrogen gas in the combustion air? Wouldn’t that gas just dissipate back into the atmosphere?
Is there some toxic effect that kills microorganisms and releases the nutrients from their decaying bodies into the soil?

Question for moderators, Murray, Emile or Trevor – is there some scientific explanation for what’s going on here?

[SASKFARMER3]

I did talk to one guy why seeded 5300 acres and very little N but did top dress using his sprayer 13 gallon nozzles a blend of 2 gallon nitrogen 10 gallon water and 1 gallon sulfur.
It seems to be worth about 22,000 that's for the year tech, equip, service you provide information for research etc. trying to sell off sets to city people, farmers get back some of these monies from that, a percentage. Higher than C-green an acre by a lot.
Need info on feds offset trading scheme, their sounds like somethings coming. But has any one seen what the crop looks like?

[wmoebis]

CBC did an artical on this.

I punched in "tractor exhaust airseeder" into google and found it.

Interesting if anyone finds more let us know.

[mhartman]

Here is a link to a patent description that discharges engine exhaust into soil for fertilization. Scroll down the page to read the summary.
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4632044.html

[FarmRanger]

Thanks Murray,

According to that patent literature,
“3. The method according to claim 1 further comprising the step of adding to said hot gaseous mixture after it is compressed, but before it is introduced into the soil, a supplemental plant nutrient.”

Isn’t that just fancy talk for; we’re adding fertilizer to hot air from the engine rather than cold air straight from the atmosphere. Which begs the question, what advantage is there to heating air from the grain cart if the nutrient value has to be added? That patent claim doesn’t appear to be making fertilizer claims of the exhaust by itself?
Counter to the patent claim, the CBC story that wmoebis referred to made it look like the exhaust itself was adding N, but the CBC reporter may have misquoted?

[mhartman]

"The products resulting from the combustion of hydrocarbon fuel includes most of the principal nutrients required by the soil for the production of crops, and specifically nitrogen, carbon, sulfur, in ionic elemental or radical form, and various compounds thereof, such as carbon dioxide, nitrogen hydride and anhydrous ammonia. The ambient air is the primary source of the nitrogen, while the carbon and sulfur are derived from the hot exhaust gasses. Although air, is ingested into the internal combustion engine and reacts with the hydrocarbon fuel in the combustion process to produce many of the nutrient nitrogen compounds and oxidation compounds, nevertheless, substantial quantities of additional nitrogen and oxygen from the ambient air are combined in the collection chamber with the hot gaseous products of combustion, as free ionic elements to improve the activity of the aerobic microorganisms in the soil, or to combine with the hot products of combustion to provide additional compounds of nitrogen and oxygen."

My question would be: how many pounds per acre of each nutrient would be provided by exhaust gas? My guess would be: not much. And what would be the impact on plant growth to stimulate microbe growth in the soil? Is it speeding up decomposition and release of nutrients from organic matter? Could it increase root diseases? I have to agree with the others that this idea sounds far-fetched.