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Lyle in Washington

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    Lyle in Washington

    This appeared today in the Intelligencer (the daily in Lyle Vanclief's home riding for those who don't know)

    "U.S. subsidy bill could push Canadian farmers to financial ruin: Vanclief


    Belleville Intelligencer







    By Derek Baldwin

    The Intelligencer

    WASHINGTON, D.C. A new draft farm bill promising $73.9 billion in new subsidies for United States' farmers could push Canadian farmers to the brink of financial ruin, warned federal Agriculture Minister Lyle Vanclief Wednesday in an emergency policy mission to the American capital.

    On day two of discussions by a committee of U.S. senators and House representatives struck to draft a new farm bill for approval by President George W. Bush Vanclief wasted no time spreading his message that expanded domestic and export subsidies south of the border would have a devastating trade impact for Canada and other nations.

    American assistance to farmers is already two-and-a-half times higher than Canadian subsidies, said the Prince Edward-Hastings MP. And even more U.S. government farm cash proposed for the next 10 years would drastically widen the disparity between the two countries because the new funding is over and above this year's projected $108 billion budget of the United States Department of Agriculture (USDA).

    By comparison, Canada's highest estimated annual payout to cover disaster relief and crop insurance due to floods and droughts in recent years was roughly $2 billion in 2001, and that included provincial money.

    Canada's far smaller population and relative tax base make it impossible for Canada to compete with the funds available to American legislators who are catering to an out-of-control farm lobby bent on "farming the mailbox for handouts, rather than farming the land," Vanclief said.

    Flanked by an entourage of Canadian politicians, federal agricultural staff, and farm industry leaders Wednesday, Vanclief trudged on through a 26-hour itinerary of pressing flesh with American reporters, lobbyists, and high-ranking politicians.

    He broke from his whirlwind tour of the capital to deliver a late afternoon address at a national agricultural conference of farm leaders from across the United States. Vanclief was to follow a speech by U.S. Secretary of Agriculture Ann M. Veneman, but she pulled out of the engagement. Vanclief did not secure a meeting with Veneman during his visit.

    In his speech, however, to 100 conference attendees gathered at the Washington Marriott, Vanclief said several elements in the U.S. draft farm bill are raising eyebrows around the world for fear of an unparalleled escalation in subsidies to prop up American farmers.

    Such a move could further upset farm product market prices that are already damaging the family farm's ability to survive, he said.

    Vanclief reminded the conference that he signed an important agreement late last fall in Doha, Qatar, with U.S. Agriculture Secretary Veneman and other world agriculture leaders to begin eliminating or reducing subsidies by 2005 in favour of new programs that allow natural forces of the marketplace to dictate prices of crops and livestock.

    "Doha was an important step forward for those who support greater international understanding, co-operation and freer trade among nations. But the message we are bringing to you here today in Washington, is that the provisions of the farm bill, as it currently stands, risk moving us backwards," said Vanclief.

    "Repercussions of one country's actions reverberate throughout the entire system. And that fallout is all the more significant given the close economic ties between our two countries and given the reality that your country sets the benchmark when it comes to world commodity prices."

    Vanclief later told American reporters that the U.S. Congress needs to remain committed to its agreement to set an example, but he said it appears Washington is talking out of both sides of its mouth.

    "The concern that is coming very clearly now, and I'm not the only who is saying it, is the concern that United States won't walk the talk in the U.S. that they are talking in Geneva and other areas," said Vanclief. "Our concern is that much of the farm bill will take us back to the bad old days of trade...where we were 15 or 20 years ago."

    Vanclief had other concerns stemming from related new provisions in the proposed farm bill, including entirely new direct subsidy funding for peas and lentil crops, labelling of all meat sold in the United States to show the products' country-of-origin. He also had a further proposal that would prevent imported meat from receiving a quality grade from the governing USDA.

    As Canadian farmers turn to alternative crops such as peas and lentils to buffer heavy losses due to plummeting grain and oilseed prices, heavy subsidization of the new alternative crops in the United States would hurt farmers once again.

    Canada delegation member and NDP federal agriculture critic Dick Proctor fully backed Vanclief, noting Saskatchewan and other Canadian provinces have moved to peas and lentils to save their farm industry.

    Peas and lentils ? dubbed "pulse" crops by Canadian farmers ? are currently not subsidized and demand strong market prices, said Proctor, because there is no government interference in the market for the legume sector. Subsidies, however, in the United States could see U.S. farmers guaranteed a price of five cents more than Canadian farmers are getting for similar crops, making that sector far less competitive.

    "This farm bill would be terribly trade-distorting for Saskatchewan, which is where most of the peas and lentils are grown. This is what we have done to compensate for the grain and oilseed falloff. This would just kill us if these subsidies are brought in," said Proctor. "These new crops have been a salvation to our guys. If we were to lose that, people would throw up their hands and it would be the last straw."

    Canadian Federation of Agriculture president Bob Friesen also supported Vanclief's Washington blitz to sound the alarm bells among the political set.

    "We have to seriously look at how we're going to mitigate the impact of high levels in other countries. We've been very discouraged in talking to farm leaders in Europe and the U.S. when they talk about continuing high levels of spending. Clearly, here in Washington, it doesn't look like they have any intention of pulling back," said Friesen."

    #2
    Are the Americans so wrong? And the Europeans? Van Clief,being such an agricultural wizard that he went belly up, knows more than the rest of the civilized world? He should quit complaining about the Americans because they want to save their farmers. Obviously the Canadian government just doesn't get it. If the farmer can't make a living he will quit, which the federal government thinks would be just dandy. Then we could import all that cheap south American grain and meat and have more money to spend on the necessities of life...SUVs, vacations down south, big screen TVs!! That's the mindset in Ottawa!

    Comment


      #3
      About 3 weeks back region 4 of the Ontario Corn Producer's Association met and voted to ask for Vanclief's resignation. This is the region next to the region containing Vanclief's home riding. By the end of the meeting they had raised $1000 to help lobby for either a resignation or removal from cabinet, and as far as I know they're still growing. Also, today the Ontario Federation of Agriculture and local county federations are going after the urban MP's across Ontario regarding agriculture and the government's lack of action. I think Vanclief's words in Washington may have had more to do with these two things than anything else. Sounds better for him and the Liberals if it's all the fault of the Americans.

      Comment


        #4
        Maybe it's time we all do the same thing.We could each get our provincial lobbying groups to band together and follow the stand taken in Ontario.In all honesty I don't know how that man with his attitude has not been assassinated yet.

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          #5
          Good for those Ontario farmers. I'm going to phone my own MP and complain although its sort of preaching to the converted. Maybe now that the Alliance has gotten rid of their main idiot they will have some alternatives to the Chretien Mob. Wouldn't it be nice to actually be governed by a government that cared about the grassroots little guys?

          Comment


            #6
            I can't imagine any government having a person in charge of agriculture that hates farmers. Just because he wasn't able to make a living in the most protected segment of Canadian agriculture doesn't mean that the rest of the farmers of Canada are as imcompetent. We don't expect miracles from this government but just a chance to make an honest living. I think that the interest of all Canadians would be better served with his immediate replacement.

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              #7
              Most protected segment in agriculture? I don't know if many hog, cash crop and fruit and vegetable farmers would agree with that statement.

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                #8
                Lyle Does Hate Farmers Just Look At Him When He Is Interviewed On Tv.The US & The Europeans Support Their Farmers With Subsidies To Assure Their Survial,Not Here They Know What It Is Like To Go Hungry, You Can not Play The Same Game With Different Rules.
                WAKE UP LYLE

                Comment


                  #9
                  Carebear: When you say the most protected segment of agriculture I am assuming you mean dairy? Now I believe the dairy industry has gotten a bad rap over the years. Don't ever believe all the garbage you hear about how our dairy man has it so much better than the U.S. dairy farmer. The U.S. dairy farmer is on the government tit big time!
                  I have a friend whose family runs a large dairy farm. He tells me their quota is worth over $9 million dollars!
                  They are 5 brothers so they get a break from milking now and then. But I never begrudge a dairy farmer getting a little bit from the government...they do a job not very many of us could handle.
                  Now consider why the government sweetens the pot...do you believe it is because they really care about our dairy farmers?? Or could it be because the big food companies need a stable(read that cheap) supply of dairy products? Once again take a look at how much the farmer recieves from the product and how much goes to the processor/ retailer!
                  Now I don't know about you, but I think the guy squeezing the tits at 4 A.M. maybe deserves to make a decent living???

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                    #10
                    Cowman: I don't begrudge the treatment that the dairyman gets, all I say is lets treat the rest of the segments of agriculture the same. Governments have pitted one segment against the other for years and as long as they keep us fighting amongst ourselves they get a free ride without having to step up to the table with meaningful programs.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Brihau - the Europeans haven't gone hungry for a long time - several decades in fact, so that argument simply doesn't wash anymore. Granted, they have had more than their fare share of food scares, but they aren't going hungry. They need to quit producing at 135% and oversupplying.

                      As far as the dairy goes, cowman, if it were just a little bit that extra that they were getting, one could possibly live with it, but it's more than just a little bit. There is a paper written by Owen Lippert of the Fraser Institute that is entitled "Milk - the Perfect Food - the Perfect Mess". In it he talks about the fact that of the $4 billion in "subsidy" money paid out, 97% of that went to the dairy industry. Now, does that sound like it's just a little bit to you? Yes, they do work very hard and most of us do not want that kind of life, but it is a choice that they make to do it, so like the rest of us, they have to deal with the consequences of their choice and if that means that they are up at 4:00 a.m. milking, then so be it. It's no different than you being out at 1:30 in the morning when it's -30 and snowing and you're checking for calves. Not a fun part of the job, but it's part of it nonetheless.

                      In some ways I find it a little hard to compare the tractor industry with that of the food industry. Yes, when the demand for tractors goes down, they close plants, lay off people etc. but maintain the price of the tractors. We can live without them, but food we cannot live without. Some of us may be able to go a little longer than some, but we still all need to eat.

                      My concern with the dairy industry is that they want to keep supply management firmly in place, but now they want to get into the export game. You can't have it both ways. You're either in or you're out.

                      The other problems with the supply managed sectors is that there is no need to be innovative, it creates artificial barriers to entry because who can afford to capitalize $9 million just to get started, the only ones who are actually doing quite well at dairying are those who got in when quota was free - as you've pointed out everything isn't entirely rosy in the dairy industry - the small family farm that supply management was supposed to save is slowly disappering as well because the big guys are the only ones who can afford to keep buying up quota.

                      There are those who believe that when push comes to shove at WTO talks, that in order to get something we want, Canada will put supply management on the line. How true that is and when it will occur is anyone's guess.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Linda: The problem with pulling all the subsidies for the dairy man is that without them he can't compete with the heavily subsidized American dairy industry. Sort of like the same thing that is happening with our grain. We know the government should step in and match the Americans and Europeans on grain; that is if they want an export grain business. If they don't want a dairy business...it's simple scrap the subsidies. And please do not forget, who benefits from the dairy subsidies the most?? The big food corporations!
                        You are very correct when you say the $9 million quota was free or bought at low prices. Still it is real property and if the government decides to cave in on supply management they had better have their checkbooks handy!
                        Why do you think dairy farmers have so much clout? It is because they were the only farmers with enough guts to "bell the cat" when they occupied the house of commons and fought with the police in 1967!
                        I wonder how the writer you referred to describes "subsidy"? You state he said $4 billion of which 97% goes to dairy. That only leaves $120 million for the rest of us! I know Alberta spent a lot more than that just on drought payments last year. And probably a lot more on crop insurance. Even our farm fuel rebate for one province is that much at least.
                        The dairy industry in Canada is not some backwater of production. Our dairy farmers are very modern and quick to adopt technology. We also have some of the most superior genetics in the world.
                        And the final argument: If it is such a rosy picture, we should all go out and start milking cows. With the unlimited wealth from subsidies I'm sure the bankers would just be falling all over themselves to give us money.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          It's not that the Americans are subsidized so much as they play with the world price and New Zealand is the low cost producer there. That is where the competition comes in and is why the U.S. and New Zealand have banded together in terms of their dispute with what they feel are Canadian subsidies.

                          If we were to loose the supply managed dairy industry, the income for our dairy farmers would drop by some 60% overnight. These were figures that the USDA showed us when we were in Washington last year.

                          Part of the problem cowman is that the dairy industry are not told these are subsidies - they are something else.

                          For me it's simple, if they want to have their quota system and keep foreign imports out, then they can't be in the export game themselves. They need the quota system in order to be able to stay alive in Canada. When it comes to fluid milk, the US could produce what we use in one year in a matter of weeks. Same with chicken and eggs. We won't ever see the demise of the quota system - at least not without a huge fight - because 48% of it is concentrated in Quebec and our own minister has vowed to keep it in place. I guess one way to look at it is that one sector keeps doing okay and the rest struggle. What would happen if the government vowed to keep the other sectors going?

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Carebear: What does dairy have to do with Vanclief's farming background? He wasn't a dairy farmer.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Cakadu: The US dairy industry is in a strange place right now. If it weren't for a lot of Canadian heifers moving south of the border, they would be in a position of constantly decreasing production every year. A lot of the big herds in the midwest and southwest just buy bred heifers, calve them out, put them right on BST and milk them 1000 days then ship them to McDonalds. Never even consider rebreeding, just buy more Canadian heifers. We sold 10 off our farm today.
                              I've seen a couple of studies looking at opening up the milk trade between Canada and US from US researchers that concluded that milk would move north to the prairies, south from Ontario and Quebec, and BC and the maritimes would stay about even with where they are now.

                              Comment

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