Alberta's dark age

[per]

I hit a duck with the windshield of my truck yesterday. It startled the quack out of me. I wonder what the ratio of ducks dead to GDP created is. That would make the duck I hit exponentially more tragic. We need not disregard the wild life but we also have to look at our own selves and how we interact with nature.

[coppertop]

I would suspect that a lot more than 500 deer are killed annually on our highways, yet there hasn't been an outcry about it !

I am not trying to minimize the issue with the ducks at Ft. Mac, but lets try and keep it all in perspective.

[cakadu]

You're right copper, we need to keep this in perspective and at the same time not dismiss it either. You're earlier point about what else is amiss up there is a valid one.

With keeping things in perspective, those tailings ponds are not getting any smaller, in fact they are increasing in size and will continue to do so as long as they are in a frenzy up there. We can't do anything about the ducks that were lost (begs the question as to how many birds and wildlife are affected on a yearly basis).

What we can look toward is how to prevent this in the future and more importantly what emergency preparedness is in place if (maybe even when) something more serious happens. Let's be realistic, there is huge potential for an environmental disaster with these tailings ponds, not to mention the challenges being encountered by folks who live in those areas.

What I believe is happening with the ducks is drawing attention to the potential for even greater problems. Notice I've referred to potential.

Maybe one day the technology will exist to be able to do something with the sludge, but for now we have to be proactive and diligent in our stewardship.

[wilagro]

A lot of people don't realize that those tailing ponds are growing every year. They still haven't found a method to clean the dissolved silt, oil residue and now dead ducks, out of the water and it is just sitting there and can't be returned to the river from which it came as it is bloody well POLLUTED.

Seems to me that they should have done more research BEFORE major expansion was allowed.

[cakadu]

Wilagro, it's called being over $125/barrel of oil. As long as the money is coming in like that, we have to ask whether or not environmental concerns will ever be first.

I will continue to push for 10% of the surplus going towards restoration, reclamation and just plain old preservation. Sadly, much of the damage that has already been done is irreparable and it will be future generations that pay for it, not us.

[coppertop]

WE, ALBERTANS, should not have to pay for restoration, it should be the companies that create the problem.

Far too often the taxpayer ends up cleaning the mess others leave behind,

[cakadu]

I'll play devil's advocate, for a moment coppertop.

It is the government that cut back people doing reclamation orders, so there is no enforcement and/or thorough follow-up.

It is the government that is heralding how safe our oil is, tarsands included.

It is also this same government that is saying full-steam ahead on economic development.

The government has eased up on collecting more royalties, at a cost to us, the taxpaying Albertans.

So, in essence, we COULD be getting the companies to pay for the clean-up if we enforced and inspected the reclamations, if we collected more in royalties that could be set aside for reclamation efforts and we took a long, hard look at the impacts of what we are doing.

[grassfarmer]

"Suzuki is a joke, he is an extremely high paid spokesperson for environmental groups, and as far as Greenpeace goes, they must be getting paid to do what they do, because they seem to spend a lot of time doing it !"
That's very PC thinking Coppertop - believe it or not some people are politically active because they believe in trying to make the world a better place. Who would be paying Greenpeace to act the way they do? That is maybe how the corporate buddies of your AB PC government do business - buy whatever decision is favorable to them from weak spined politicians it doesn't mean it's how the rest of society operates.

As for Suzuki being a joke - try looking in the mirror - what of a Government that has no longterm thinking capability beyond how many dollars they can raise through resource exploitation this week. It seems they'd sell their granny to the Americans if they thought they'd get $5 for her! It just doesn't seem to matter who or what gets damaged in the process. Poison the environment, ruin the landscape, kill the wildlife it's all acceptable progress in the lust for the almighty dollar.

[coppertop]

grassfarmer, Sixuki is a joke, highly paid as are Greenpeace. Do you agree with crashing a private diner where the guests paid $450.00 a plate to listen to the Premier ? I you paid good money to listen to a speaker would you be impressed if the Premier decended from the rafters unfurling a sign ?????
Greenpeace are activists, and they have their ' flavor of the week', and this week it is the oilsands.

I am sure that you or any other citizen could get more attention from the government by sending a well worded, factual letter itemizing your concerns on any issue, including the oilsands, than Greenpeace is going to get with all their theatrics.

I have never said I agreed with every single policy of our provincial government, and if you have read my posts on many subjects you will know that. I always feel it is best to work with the government in power to bring about changes to legislation or policy that aren't in the best interest of Albertan vs being confrontational, abraisive etc.

[grassfarmer]

coppertop, you didn't supply me with an answer as to who pays Greenpeace. Isn't it the case that they are in fact only "paid" by donations from individual citizens around the world concerned about some of the environmental disasters man is creating? There is less of a hidden agenda behind who pays them than there is with the revolving door of corporations and politicians in North America.
Crashing a "private" dinner hosted by a politician is an acceptable form of political protest in my book given that it was really a public event given that tickets were sold for it.
I'm not sorry for the guys that paid $450 a ticket to buy time with the premier so they could lobby him to promote their personal interests ahead of those of the average citizen who the premier, and government, are supposed to represent.

If only writing letters were the answer... Unfortunately in the non functioning democracy we have in Alberta we do need to use other tactics. As with the powerline controversy it seems that we have more chance of influencing the outcome by appealing to the more environmentally conscious power consumers of California than we do trying to influence our own Government.
The Greenpeace protesters showed some initiative in their efforts and were duly rewarded with extensive media coverage. Greenpeace have come a long way in the last twenty years and are no longer viewed as the lunatic group they once were. No Government would be bold enough(or stupid enough) now to blow up the Rainbow Warrior as Greenpeace have become an accepted part of our political landscape.
In closing I would dispute their banner message though - I don't think $telmach is the best premier oil money can buy - Ralph was a way more effective buy for big oil.

[coppertop]

Grassfarmer, as you are well aware, Greenpeace, the Sierra Club, PETA and dozens of other organizations are funded by donations.

I do take exception to anyone CRASHING a fund raising dinner. If I or anyone else choose to pay $450 for a ticket to attend a fundraiser, I should expect to hear the feature speaker, enjoy the entertainment, be treated to an enjoyable meal, all without having to put up with disruption from uninvited guests.
Drawing attention to one's CAUSE by rudeness does nothing to enhance the individual or group that caused the distription.
In fact you are wrong to suggest that those who attend the dinner go there to lobby the Premier, they attend to support a fundraiser for the PC party. Pretty difficult to lobby the Premier in a crowd of 1600 people.
Having a private discussion with the Premier is much more successful at an event in one's local community. He has always been very accessable, but idiotic stunts like the one Greenpeace engaged in is going to make it extremely difficult for the average Albertan to have acess to our heads of government.

[Burbert]

Let me see now. When was the last time anyone, and I mean anyone paid any attention whatsoever, to a peaceful, orderly, low key demonstration? There has to be a stunt, protest or violence to even get noticed by the media, or anyone at all. Ain't democracy a weird and wonderful thing? No government opposition means the media must pick up the slack, like here in Alberta, hence stunts, pie in the eye or ceiling hanging is required, direct action.....