Alberta 2 grid alerts in 2 days

[Guest]

One more chuckles
If hydro so good how come we can’t build any more ?
Tobin and codette lakes are a godsend to this area
They *** near crucified PC’s for building rafferty/alameda just for irrigation
You know , Roy’s boys ?

[jazz]

Alberta FF literally holding up the grid in western Canada today. Solar = zero

[chuckChuck]

There you go using the words low cost and wind and solar in the same sentence. I don't think that means what you think it means. Unless of course you have found an example somewhere in the world where additional solar and wind have translated into lower costs for the consumers?

According to the IEA and IRENA renewables are the lowest cost generation sources in many parts of the world. Of course there are other costs but when comparing generation costs per kwh they win. So how can you ignore their cost advantage when used strategically?

Now its your turn to prove with credible evidence that the only reason prices for consumers have risen is because of renewables. Good luck! We are waiting. And your arm chair opinions are not evidence! LOL

https://www.irena.org/News/pressreleases/2022/Jul/Renewable-Power-Remains-Cost-Competitive-amid-Fossil-Fuel-Crisis

New IRENA report shows almost two-thirds of renewable power added in 2021 had lower costs than the cheapest coal-fired options in G20 countries.

Abu Dhabi, UAE, 13 July 2022 – Costs for renewables continued to fall in 2021 as supply chain challenges and rising commodity prices have yet to show their full impact on project costs. The cost of electricity from onshore wind fell by 15%, offshore wind by 13% and solar PV by 13% compared to 2020.

Renewable Power Generation Costs in 2021, published by the International Renewable Energy Agency (IRENA) today, shows that almost two-thirds or 163 gigawatts (GW) of newly installed renewable power in 2021 had lower costs than the world’s cheapest coal-fired option in the G20. IRENA estimates that, given the current high fossil fuel prices, the renewable power added in 2021 saves around USD 55 billion from global energy generation costs in 2022.

IRENA’s new report confirms the critical role that cost-competitive renewables play in addressing today’s energy and climate emergencies by accelerating the transition in line with the 1.5°C warming limit and the Paris Agreement goals. Solar and wind energy, with their relatively short project lead times, represent vital planks in countries’ efforts to swiftly reduce, and eventually phase out, fossil fuels and limit the macroeconomic damages they cause in pursuit of net zero.

“Renewables are by far the cheapest form of power today,” Francesco La Camera, Director-General of IRENA said. “2022 is a stark example of just how economically viable new renewable power generation has become. Renewable power frees economies from volatile fossil fuel prices and imports, curbs energy costs and enhances market resilience – even more so if today’s energy crunch continues.”

https://www.iea.org/fuels-and-technologies/solar

Solar PV still dominates renewable energy capacity additions despite rising prices
Even with surging commodity prices increasing manufacturing costs for solar PV, its capacity additions are forecast to grow by 17% in 2021. This will set a new annual record of almost 160 GW. Solar PV alone accounts for 60% of all renewable capacity additions, with almost 1 100 GW becoming operational over the forecast period in our main case, double the rate over the previous five years. In a significant majority of countries worldwide, utility-scale solar PV is the least costly option for adding new electricity capacity, especially amid rising natural gas and coal prices. Utility-scale solar projects continue to provide over 60% of all solar PV additions worldwide. Meanwhile, policy initiatives in China, the European Union and India are boosting the deployment of commercial and residential PV projects.

[Hamloc]

According to the IEA and IRENA renewables are the lowest cost generation sources in many parts of the world. Of course there are other costs but when comparing generation costs per kwh they win. So how can you ignore their cost advantage when used strategically?

Now its your turn to prove with credible evidence that the only reason prices for consumers have risen is because of renewables. Good luck! We are waiting. And your arm chair opinions are not evidence! LOL

https://www.irena.org/News/pressreleases/2022/Jul/Renewable-Power-Remains-Cost-Competitive-amid-Fossil-Fuel-Crisis

New IRENA report shows almost two-thirds of renewable power added in 2021 had lower costs than the cheapest coal-fired options in G20 countries.

Abu Dhabi, UAE, 13 July 2022 – Costs for renewables continued to fall in 2021 as supply chain challenges and rising commodity prices have yet to show their full impact on project costs. The cost of electricity from onshore wind fell by 15%, offshore wind by 13% and solar PV by 13% compared to 2020.

Renewable Power Generation Costs in 2021, published by the International Renewable Energy Agency (IRENA) today, shows that almost two-thirds or 163 gigawatts (GW) of newly installed renewable power in 2021 had lower costs than the world’s cheapest coal-fired option in the G20. IRENA estimates that, given the current high fossil fuel prices, the renewable power added in 2021 saves around USD 55 billion from global energy generation costs in 2022.

IRENA’s new report confirms the critical role that cost-competitive renewables play in addressing today’s energy and climate emergencies by accelerating the transition in line with the 1.5°C warming limit and the Paris Agreement goals. Solar and wind energy, with their relatively short project lead times, represent vital planks in countries’ efforts to swiftly reduce, and eventually phase out, fossil fuels and limit the macroeconomic damages they cause in pursuit of net zero.

“Renewables are by far the cheapest form of power today,” Francesco La Camera, Director-General of IRENA said. “2022 is a stark example of just how economically viable new renewable power generation has become. Renewable power frees economies from volatile fossil fuel prices and imports, curbs energy costs and enhances market resilience – even more so if today’s energy crunch continues.”

https://www.iea.org/fuels-and-technologies/solar

Solar PV still dominates renewable energy capacity additions despite rising prices
Even with surging commodity prices increasing manufacturing costs for solar PV, its capacity additions are forecast to grow by 17% in 2021. This will set a new annual record of almost 160 GW. Solar PV alone accounts for 60% of all renewable capacity additions, with almost 1 100 GW becoming operational over the forecast period in our main case, double the rate over the previous five years. In a significant majority of countries worldwide, utility-scale solar PV is the least costly option for adding new electricity capacity, especially amid rising natural gas and coal prices. Utility-scale solar projects continue to provide over 60% of all solar PV additions worldwide. Meanwhile, policy initiatives in China, the European Union and India are boosting the deployment of commercial and residential PV projects.

Here is the question Chuck2, so what if it is cheap? Watching solar power output on the AESO supply demand page, solar power is produced for roughly 8 hrs of the 24 hr day this time of year. Peak production obviously occurs between 11 am and 1 pm. It has been peaking at roughly 33% of production capacity. Between 4 pm and 7 pm is peak consumption. Solar has gone to bed by then. When it is -30 heat is the difference between life and death, that simple.

As for wind, looks like a change in weather for the weekend has brought wind generation out of its 5 day slumber. I think wind and solar are nice virtue signalling generation sources that can be added to the grid but the reality is they cannot be depended on 24 hours a day 365 days a year!!!!!

[jazz]

Talk about checking out from reality eh chuck.

Sask is done with the windmill and solar farce. It doesnt generate any baseload and even any peaking load as you can see from Ab numbers. And it can never pay for itself. Sure it works in the Sahara or outback, but not where people need the power.

There will never be another hydro dam built in this country unless perhaps Ab bails out Mb obscene budget overruns and someone can bribe the native bands enough.

Anyway, Sask is done with all that and going to an actual solution. Nuke plant being sited at Alameda or Diefenbaker.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/saskpower-smr-nuclear-1.6589247

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Here is the question Chuck2, so what if it is cheap? Watching solar power output on the AESO supply demand page, solar power is produced for roughly 8 hrs of the 24 hr day this time of year. Peak production obviously occurs between 11 am and 1 pm. It has been peaking at roughly 33% of production capacity. Between 4 pm and 7 pm is peak consumption. Solar has gone to bed by then. When it is -30 heat is the difference between life and death, that simple.

As for wind, looks like a change in weather for the weekend has brought wind generation out of its 5 day slumber. I think wind and solar are nice virtue signalling generation sources that can be added to the grid but the reality is they cannot be depended on 24 hours a day 365 days a year!!!!!

And that change in the weather just happens to be warming out of this cold snap. As we have been observing for as many years as this debate has been ongoing, wind generation is completely out of sync with power demand during the winter. On the coldest days/nights when demand is highest, the wind is nowhere to be seen. It has spent days at less than a couple of percent of capacity. Now a Chinook wind is blowing in, with that, demand drops, and generation goes up. Happens every time.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

utility-scale solar PV is the least costly option for adding new electricity capacity,

Do you ever read the fine print Chuck?

Cheapest capacity? Is that the same thing as cheapest generation, let alone cheapest delivered to the consumer?
Keeping in mind that here in sunny Alberta, Brooks 1, the first solar farm I checked just now, has a 4 year capacity factor of 15.7%

So if it is as you claim, the cheapest electricity capacity, but it only produces at 6.5 times less than the name plate capacity, do you think it is still the cheapest generation source?

Why do you continue to embarrass yourself by posting cut and paste articles which you clearly do not even know how to interpret? Do you even attempt to read what they say, to check if they don't actually contradict your own ideological biases?

All you have to do is provide a single example of lower (relative) power bills of any place in the world, resulting from the addition of solar or wind. By far the easiest homework I have ever given you. And you have failed repeatedly for years.

[Hamloc]

Do you ever read the fine print Chuck?

Cheapest capacity? Is that the same thing as cheapest generation, let alone cheapest delivered to the consumer?
Keeping in mind that here in sunny Alberta, Brooks 1, the first solar farm I checked just now, has a 4 year capacity factor of 15.7%

So if it is as you claim, the cheapest electricity capacity, but it only produces at 6.5 times less than the name plate capacity, do you think it is still the cheapest generation source?

Why do you continue to embarrass yourself by posting cut and paste articles which you clearly do not even know how to interpret? Do you even attempt to read what they say, to check if they don't actually contradict your own ideological biases?

All you have to do is provide a single example of lower (relative) power bills of any place in the world, resulting from the addition of solar or wind. By far the easiest homework I have ever given you. And you have failed repeatedly for years.

Most important point is the building of solar and wind capacity is no guarantee of generation, certainly not 24 hr. a day generation you can depend on!

[shtferbrains]

The other part of this is companies like Amazon contract for solar power to greenwash their dirtiest delivery system.

So 16 hrs a day they are delivered brown energy for premium price?

[chuckChuck]

Do you ever read the fine print Chuck?

Cheapest capacity? Is that the same thing as cheapest generation, let alone cheapest delivered to the consumer?
Keeping in mind that here in sunny Alberta, Brooks 1, the first solar farm I checked just now, has a 4 year capacity factor of 15.7%

So if it is as you claim, the cheapest electricity capacity, but it only produces at 6.5 times less than the name plate capacity, do you think it is still the cheapest generation source?

Why do you continue to embarrass yourself by posting cut and paste articles which you clearly do not even know how to interpret? Do you even attempt to read what they say, to check if they don't actually contradict your own ideological biases?

All you have to do is provide a single example of lower (relative) power bills of any place in the world, resulting from the addition of solar or wind. By far the easiest homework I have ever given you. And you have failed repeatedly for years.

That's easy. On my own farm! I hardly pay anything for electricity from Saskpower because my solar system produces more kwh than i need most years depending on how much i run my aeration fans for drying grain. And even if you factor in the capital cost of the panels it still is cheaper than Saskpower and much cheaper than the rate most farmers pay in Alberta.

[TSIPP]

Government subsidized solar panels is the only reason why.

[chuckChuck]

In Saskatchewan the electricity cost farmers pay are lower than what city and town residents pay even though the cost of delivering electricity to every farm and rural resident is higher because of the long distant sparsely populated rural areas.

In effect farmers are getting subsidized with lower farm rates.