Ukraine situation?

[fjlip]

Another opinion...This is where 200 sheet metal all wheel drive coffins will be showing up at $450,000 per unit courtesy of CND taxpayers. Not sure how much you can buy them for when they land in Poland.

[agstar77]

Another opinion...This is where 200 sheet metal all wheel drive coffins will be showing up at $450,000 per unit courtesy of CND taxpayers. Not sure how much you can buy them for when they land in Poland.

Would you be brave enough to get into one of those vehicles to defend your country or are you just a coward that belittles brave men and women?

[jazz]

Anybody volunteering to die for the deep state is a fool.

[agstar77]

Anybody volunteering to die for the deep state is a fool.

Well Russian state is pretty deep. I guess you advocating for them , makes you??

[fjlip]

How is anyone winning there? They are dying, wrecking their country, we are sending $$/ iron that gets destroyed. Canadian volunteers dying. Big business for SCRAP dealers by the pics we see.
And the arms manufacturers making BILLIONS $$.
Turmoil leading to terrible economic fallout planet wide. We will pay more, and so will our children.
We are all losers.

If rest of Canada wanted to fight to stop Quebec from leaving, would we sacrifice our children to keep them here?

Watch that video, maybe Poland is the problem. Old HATE motivates. Search the massacres mentioned. Sad

[jazz]

Well Russian state is pretty deep. I guess you advocating for them , makes you??

When Putin forces my trade in rubles linked to their CB fiat printing press and backed by force with their military, I will feel the same way. Until then....

Watch that video, maybe Poland is the problem. Old HATE motivates. Search the massacres mentioned. Sad

Poland is still bitter about land lost in WW2. They are planning on making a grab for the area around LVIV.

Deep state wanted to Balkanize Russia, instead they will destroy nato and balkanize Ukraine.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

How is anyone winning there? They are dying, wrecking their country, we are sending $$/ iron that gets destroyed. Canadian volunteers dying. Big business for SCRAP dealers by the pics we see.
And the arms manufacturers making BILLIONS $$.
Turmoil leading to terrible economic fallout planet wide. We will pay more, and so will our children.
We are all losers.

If rest of Canada wanted to fight to stop Quebec from leaving, would we sacrifice our children to keep them here?

Watch that video, maybe Poland is the problem. Old HATE motivates. Search the massacres mentioned. Sad

I keep asking, what is in it for the citizens? Will they be any better or worse off if it is Russian or Ukrainian oligarchs, mafia and corrupt politicians stealing from them? And is it worth dying so that one set of corrupt politicians can try to beat another set? If anything, in Ukraine, the mafia controls the government, in Russia, it is mostly the other way around. In Russia, the GDP is higher, so even after all of the grift is skimmed off, somewhat more is left over to trickle down to the peasants. Even if the two economies were combined, the Ukrainian citizens would still get a smaller piece of a much bigger pie, and would have been better off economically.

Regardless of who "wins" from here forward, the citizens have already lost. Lost more than a generation of young men and women, destroyed their infrastructure, indebted forever to the west who are orchestrating a proxy war from the comfort and safety of our isolation. Driven all investment away from a region which desperately needed it, that won't come back overnight. Ignited the already festering internal civil war into an inferno, by essentially legalizing retribution against your neighbor. As we see in the middle east, these events have effects for centuries to come. It has exposed the level of corruption at all levels, further pushing away investment.

Even if the resistance had have been wildly successful, what possible upside was there ever going to be for the citizens themselves? I just cannot fathom the mindset of the war mongers in the west literally cheering for ever more death and destruction. How did the propaganda ever convince the left, who used to be the make love not war side, to gleefully encourage this war?

[agstar77]

One problem with your logic, Putin does not care and invaded Ukraine for no reason other than paranoia and delusions of grandeur. Ukraine was actually having free elections not coronations like Russia. Ignoring invasions by would be strongmen led to WW2.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

One problem with your logic, Putin does not care and invaded Ukraine for no reason other than paranoia and delusions of grandeur. Ukraine was actually having free elections not coronations like Russia. Ignoring invasions by would be strongmen led to WW2.

I know you are just looking for a fight, and I shouldn't respond, but your comparison to world war ii, is exactly the type of propaganda which has been so effective.
The Eastern front of world war II is a topic which I have studied a lot. Not only the military exploits, but the human element. The propaganda of all sides, what motivated both the soldiers and the civilians.
And obviously, those responsible for the propaganda this time around are students of the world war II era, recycling most of it word for word, just exchanging the word Nazi for the word Russians. That in itself does not mean none of it is true, then, or now, but it certainly should raise some red flags that we are supposed to be believing that 80 years later, the exact same tactics are being used, and the combatants are behaving the same. People actually fell for the idea that soldiers are stealing washing machines just like happened when the Soviet forces reached Germany during world war II.
And in that era, most people outside of the combat zone had no way to verify the authenticity of the claims, whereas today with information moving at the speed of light, we do have that option.
With the benefit of hindsight, there is no doubt that the Nazis intention was the elimination of the untermenchen, it really was an existential battle not only for the combatants, but for the civilians. In that respect, there are no parallels that can be drawn to the current situation. Except perhaps for the small minority of Ukrainians who truly do identify as nazis. If the original smo had have succeeded as intended, it wasn't going to result in death camps. It's not 1940. There might be parallels in the military strategies, but not in the political agendas.

[agstar77]

So how bad does it have to be ?. How many innocent civilians have to die? How much pillaging of resources such as grain has to happen? How many war crimes are acceptable? Who are the invaders? I don't doubt that there be some nazis lurking in Ukraine. There are deviants like those in Canada and the U.S. But the Russians are just peace loving frightened children with nuclear weapons.

[shtferbrains]

The Abrahms will take a long time. The Lepards will be a lot easier to deploy and much more practical. Comrade Jazz ,Zelenski has had a year to run. Why would now be any different? You called him to run when the war started. You are the little coward not Zelenski.

The Abrahms are there.
The Bradley's are there.
They have thousands of them sitting waiting for what the Russians are doing now.
Satellites,battle plans,espionage, weapons development.
NATO was formed in 1952??? to be ready for when the Russians came across the boarders.
Sending the Abrahms and the Bradley's that were developed for the job is like saying FU Putin you have all your cards on the table and your all in.
It's all made to enhance the whole plan.
Will it be Apachies next?

They have been waiting to use this stuff for 60+ yrs.

The only question is what happens after Putin?

[foragefarmer]

Two long winded posts pointing fingers in every direction except at the one who is responsible for the invasion of Ukraine, Putin.

" Even if the two economies were combined, the Ukrainian citizens would still get a smaller piece of a much bigger pie, and would have been better off economically."

Ab5, all your intense studying of the region and you recite a statement Stalin would have used during the Holodomor.

[fjlip]

This whole region has been KILLING each other for CENTURIES! What makes you think NOW is different? Old hatred/animosities. We are naïve innocent people here. It's a powder keg that could consume us all. A NUT case, ideologs in NATO, nobody seems to have peace in mind. All need to be the BIG CO CK in the hen house. Researched the village/area all grandparents came from, there were massacres in the 1940's, thank God they got the phuck out in 1929.

[cropgrower]

i know almost notting about whats going on , was talking to sombody more informed and they said that is some of the most blood stained ground in the world , and its not simply putin bad ukraine good , as i said before pretty sad when you cant believe the media anymore

[agstar77]

i know almost notting about whats going on , was talking to sombody more informed and they said that is some of the most blood stained ground in the world , and its not simply putin bad ukraine good , as i said before pretty sad when you cant believe the media anymore

Simple question . Would the war being going on without Putin?