A interesting tweet from a indigenous friend

[Landdownunder]

quick question how many of you guys have employed indigenous people.

my dad did and i have but he got in trouble with the dreaded iceand the law,never saw him again.

i had no idea but was a good 11 months

[AlbertaFarmer5]

This probably isn't the best thread for this, since it isn't specifically an indigenous problem, but the topic of prisons was brought up here.

Does anyone see any connection between these two?

[TSIPP]

It must be cheaper to keep the prisons full, I’ve always thought most in prison probably don’t really belong there, I’m sure it’s mental issues that put them in prison, as long as the prisoners are getting help it really doesn’t matter where they’re institutionalized but some are just plain evil and they really don’t belong in society.

Mass shooters are for sure insane, nobody sane does that stuff and the lefties blame it on guns….

[Blaithin]

Well… I’m not sure I’d use old mental hospital numbers as an example. They used to lock anyone up 😂 I think treatment and understanding of mental issues is much better than just lock them away and give them a lobotomy these days.

That said, I’m sure it has some bearing of course, just not the extreme of all those people that would’ve been in a mental hospital in the 60s are now criminals and going to jail instead.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Well… I’m not sure I’d use old mental hospital numbers as an example. They used to lock anyone up 😂 I think treatment and understanding of mental issues is much better than just lock them away and give them a lobotomy these days.

That said, I’m sure it has some bearing of course, just not the extreme of all those people that would’ve been in a mental hospital in the 60s are now criminals and going to jail instead.

No, but there is a very direct correlation between those released from mental institutions back in the day, and homelessness and addiction etc. Which in most cases leads to criminal behaviour to feed the addiction.

[Blaithin]

No, but there is a very direct correlation between those released from mental institutions back in the day, and homelessness and addiction etc. Which in most cases leads to criminal behaviour to feed the addiction.

Depends on the illness.

Most “mental illness” these days isn’t really a genetic condition like schizophrenia or bipolar, it’s people declaring themselves as depressed or having anxiety or ADHD and self treating with drugs. Which the drugs then lead to high incidence of criminal activity, yes.

Mental institutions would have had primarily schizophrenics, manic bipolars, Autistics, Downs Syndromes, etc. Not someone who gets anxious when the phone rings.

I would say most criminals who aren’t actually sociopaths would have mental illnesses that are results of their lifestyles, not of their genetics like hospitals would have previously had.

If the graph was showcasing drug use within the general population and prison capacity, that would be appropriate, but trying to compare genetic conditions hospitalized and saying that instead of being hospitalized they’re all just being jailed now, I don’t think that’s the case. I’ve never got the impression that many convicts are schizophrenic or bipolar but maybe there’s a chart somewhere breaking down the different illnesses within the prison population that would show otherwise.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Depends on the illness.

Most “mental illness” these days isn’t really a genetic condition like schizophrenia or bipolar, it’s people declaring themselves as depressed or having anxiety or ADHD and self treating with drugs. Which the drugs then lead to high incidence of criminal activity, yes.

Mental institutions would have had primarily schizophrenics, manic bipolars, Autistics, Downs Syndromes, etc. Not someone who gets anxious when the phone rings.

I would say most criminals who aren’t actually sociopaths would have mental illnesses that are results of their lifestyles, not of their genetics like hospitals would have previously had.

If the graph was showcasing drug use within the general population and prison capacity, that would be appropriate, but trying to compare genetic conditions hospitalized and saying that instead of being hospitalized they’re all just being jailed now, I don’t think that’s the case. I’ve never got the impression that many convicts are schizophrenic or bipolar but maybe there’s a chart somewhere breaking down the different illnesses within the prison population that would show otherwise.

As I said, I haven't seen any evidence that there is a correlation. I do know enough people in the industry, who corroborate that the people who used to be institutionalized and were released, make up a disoroportionate amount of the homeless and addict population. All of the modern self diagnosed anxiety type disorders, and the self-medication with substances is a completely different topic. I doubt many of these people would have been in an institution back in the day.

[Blaithin]

It would be interesting to see the chart back to 1900. If I had to guess I would say this chart is showing a contribution of peaking of PTSD from the wars.

Again that would be a lifestyle inflicted illness vs genetic and you can see the successful trend of treating these disorders as outpatients instead of institutionalizing them.

But then by your train of logic, PTSD is not being consistently, successfully treated in outpatients, they’re just in jail.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

It would be interesting to see the chart back to 1900. If I had to guess I would say this chart is showing a contribution of peaking of PTSD from the wars.

Again that would be a lifestyle inflicted illness vs genetic and you can see the successful trend of treating these disorders as outpatients instead of institutionalizing them.

But then by your train of logic, PTSD is not being consistently, successfully treated in outpatients, they’re just in jail.

That is a thought provoking perspective. You are probably on to something. Although, the patience I was aware of we're all genetic.

[Blaithin]

Yeah, I’ve got an interesting book on women being committed but it was the 18th or 19th century, not this recent.

It’s the book where I learned that the Latin word hestero means pertaining to the uterus, which is why we have hysterectomies. It’s also why it’s called hysteria because women who were mentally ill were obviously crazy just because they have a uterus 😂 If we act hysterical it’s also because of our wombs.

Those women most likely did have genetic conditions, or some form of trauma in some of the stories. It’s mind boggling how institutions treated them though. Much better off having mental issues now, that’s for sure. Go in with a panic attack and come out with a lobotomy and a hysterectomy back then! Which certainly wouldn’t help you function well.

[agstar77]

Yeah, I’ve got an interesting book on women being committed but it was the 18th or 19th century, not this recent.

It’s the book where I learned that the Latin word hestero means pertaining to the uterus, which is why we have hysterectomies. It’s also why it’s called hysteria because women who were mentally ill were obviously crazy just because they have a uterus 😂 If we act hysterical it’s also because of our wombs.

Those women most likely did have genetic conditions, or some form of trauma in some of the stories. It’s mind boggling how institutions treated them though. Much better off having mental issues now, that’s for sure. Go in with a panic attack and come out with a lobotomy and a hysterectomy back then! Which certainly wouldn’t help you function well.

Careful, you are sounding woke.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Yeah, I’ve got an interesting book on women being committed but it was the 18th or 19th century, not this recent.

It’s the book where I learned that the Latin word hestero means pertaining to the uterus, which is why we have hysterectomies. It’s also why it’s called hysteria because women who were mentally ill were obviously crazy just because they have a uterus 😂 If we act hysterical it’s also because of our wombs.

Those women most likely did have genetic conditions, or some form of trauma in some of the stories. It’s mind boggling how institutions treated them though. Much better off having mental issues now, that’s for sure. Go in with a panic attack and come out with a lobotomy and a hysterectomy back then! Which certainly wouldn’t help you function well.

There's not much about the medical system or dental system back in the good old days which I would want to trade for.

And even worse for a female.