The End of Suburbia

[les]

Deb who told you oil will run out in 10 to 20 years? I think someone was having a bad dream or they are trying to scare people like you in to a major revolution against the big oil companys.

[grassfarmer]

Quite right Deb, I'm amazed that North America continues to have such an ignorant attitude to this serious matter. All the whining here when gas is 70 cents a litre - try the $1.70 it is in the UK and you will realise why they drive economical cars. There is no excuse for this ignorance. And then we have the Yanks fighting wars the world over to ensure they can burn up everybody elses oil before finally using their own - then what?
I liked the George Bush joke:
Reporter " mr Bush what do you think of the Koyoto accord?
GW " the two door or the four door?"

[Horse]

Prosperity for who those that get 1500 $ a day for consulting or 130$ per hr for a D7 $130 a day for service trucks $24 per hr for labours and we all pay at the pumps but we dont all get the high wages .
I am not sure how much of this natural gas income gets returned to the oil companys in the form of rebate to consumers but I do know we are not getting a fair shake on royalties but as long as those in power get thier big wages there wont be any change.
Emerald how do you figure you are entitled to use as much gas as you like is it just because you can afford to.
And yes cowman I do have a grudge against the oil business in alta because I have a sence of fair play.

[Horse]

horse, would you feel differently about the wages and consulting fees that folks get if you were one of them ??
As far as what I am entitled to spend on fuel for a vehicle, I guess as long as I am paying for it, no-one else should be concerned. The cost to drive my vehicle is less than the cost to drive my farm pickup, or any other farm pickup I see at parked at the auction market or in front of the UFA !!! For years I drove a little sardine can that was easy on fuel, and was petrified everytime I had to drive on ice.....and since I put on approximately 4000 km per month I decided I was going to drive something that I was comfortable in......not that I feel the need to justify what I drive !!!!!

[Deb]

There was a terrific documentary on TV the other night called "The End of Suburbia" and was all about the fact that we have peaked in oil production and fewer sources are being found and those that are are getting more expensive to extract.

Richard Heindberg (sp?) is the world analyst of energy and he was saying we have maybe a decade and nobody is sounding alarm bells as loud as they should be. The decline of the fossil fuel age will reverse globalization. Farming will become more labour intensive, there will be political upheavel, we will all have to live more locally (as another analyst put it, we won't have our Caesar salads delivered from california by truck anymore.) Another interesting statistic was that it takes 10 calories of hydrocarbon to make one calorie of food these days.

Other speakers were Michael klare who wrote "Resource Ward" and James Howard Kunstler who wrote, "The Geography of Nowhere" which is the most comprehensive book about what will happen after the fossil fuel age.

For more on this documentary, go to
www.visiontv.ca/Programs/documentaries_endsuburbia.html

[grassfarmer]

Emrald1, I'm shocked on your attitude to this. When you always speak of our need to conserve water resources in other threads how can you reconcile that with your attitude to oil use?
Fossil fuels are a FINITE resource, by ignoring this fact civilisation as we know it will come to an end when it runs out. What gives North America the right to use up 80% of the WORLDS oil resources in a timespan of less than 150 years?
I'm disappointed I though you were a person that believed in sustainability.

[grassfarmer]

grassfarmer, get off your high horse !!! Like many people who not only farm but work FULL TIME off the farm, I drive the vehicle that suits my needs, just as I am sure you do.
As far as conserving fossil fuel goes, a good driver can conserve fuel in a larger vehicle just by good driving habits....not exceeding the posted speed limit, not revving the vehicle at ever stop light like the FONZ etc !!!
The gas mileage I get in the vehicle I drive is at the top end of what the manufacturer advertises...so I must be doing my part to conserve fuel.
I have all energy efficient appliances in my home and use a wood heater in conjunction with my gas furnace.
There are many ways we can conserve....and look after the world we live in. I would no more criticize you for your choice of vehicle than I would for your choice of banker....that is your personal business. Anyone who knows me can tell you that I have been involved in numerous environmental projects,and still am.
If my comments regarding the vehicle I drive being my business offended you, tough !!! I have agreed with many of your comments on this site and disagreed with some, but certainly do not consider it my place to judge you....

[Deb]

I'm trading in my Impala for a Ford hybrid Escape. i hope more people buy the hybrids.

[Deb]

I am not very familiar with the models of hybrid vehicles that are available, Deb, is there a significant purchase price difference between a hybrid and a regular Escape ?

[grassfarmer]

Emrald1, I wasn't critisizing your choice of vehicle or your right to choose what type you drive rather pointing out that the current fossil fuel use in North America is unsustainable. The fact that the US Government created the "van" as a means to circumnvagate long standing policy of improving fuel efficiency in general was a disgrace. Fuel consupmtion is getting progressively worse in North America, not better and that is unacceptable. The wasteful practises seen in Alberta were an eye opener to me - the guys that leave their trucks running for 40 minutes while visiting neighbours in the summer.
Simple solution put gas up to $1.50 a litre and see how quick people smarten up.
Your low fuel consumption is only relative Emrald1, I had a roomy 4 door diesel car in Scotland that did 50 miles to the gallon. Why accept these vans and SUVs that only manage 12-15 miles to the gallon?