Bashing the Americans

[cowman]

All the political commentators seem to think Paul Martin has hit a home run by bashing America with his belligerant attitude on Kyoto and telling the American ambassador to shut up! It plays well down east for sure!
But think about this for a minute? Is that really very smart? It might get him elected but he still has to deal with these guys the day after the election...if he gets back in?
Here are some pretty important things for us to consider: The US buys a lot of stuff from us. They buy a lot of our agricultural output? I guess we all know what happens when that border shuts for whatever reason? Look what it did to the beef industry?
They also buy a whole lot of our other resources? Oil and gas are what is actually paying the bills right now!
So here we have Paul spitting in George Bushes face so he can win an election...and then he has to deal with the man he insulted? If you were George Bush how would you like that? How would you deal with it? Personally I'd tell him to go to hell!
It really is not in Western Canadas best interests to alienate the Bush administration? They are our best customers. Their dollars are fueling the good times in Alberta? So we have this Quebec thug doing his best to screw us with out main customer! And there are actually people in the west who might vote for this idiot...incredible!

[FarmRanger]

The carnage left in the wake of the Liberal campaign trail will affect us for many years to come. Just goes to show how damage Mr. "I Love Canada" is willing to inflict on us to get re-elected.
Cheap shots, very cheap...Expensive for the rest of us. In addition to sabotaging markets, re-electing the Liberals will give the separatists the best advantage they could ever hope for? Saddled with the Liberals again after voting overwhelmingly against them in the regions outside Ontario? The worst nightmare for a united Canada!

[FarmRanger]

As Canadians the best way we can let the US know that we want to remain a trading partner and a good neighbour is to give Martin and his crew the boot. BC has a lot to lose in the soft wood issue but they will still vote for NDP because they have become a nanny state in many ways.

[ivbinconned]

"You can't build yourself up by tearing others down"

I think it was Lincon who said that. Martins remarks are juvenile at best.

Bush I suspect is above this and won't give it a second thought. However some thoughtless preacher down there might suggest that the PM be taken out!

[Horse]

I guess I am in the minority out west but I dont think we have to kiss the U S A ass to be good nabours Tell me one thing the U S does for us that dont benifit them?
Sure we like to trade with them but that dont mean we have to say how high every time they say jump, trade should be a recipical thing And yes politisions shouldnt tate cheap shots just to get elected but who is to blame for that ? if it didnt work they wouldnt do it so it looks to me that we are to blame .

[FarmRanger]

Why is it that not bashing our largest trading partner is kissing their backside? Need one thing we’ve got the advantage on them? Our trade surplus with the U.S. is larger than any other country. By the end of 2002 we sold $350 billion more to them than they sold to us since Mulroney’s free trade deal was signed the decade earlier. Canada accounts for 20% of U.S. trade worldwide. While it is true that trade benefits both sides, we’ve definitely had the larger piece of the pie for a while. If the shoe were on the other foot, would there be an outcry to shut the border and stop importing from, or at least balance trade from a country that insults us? Making the kind of comments that Mr. Martin has chosen as his re-election ploy looks more contempt than love for the wellbeing of Canada.

This American bashing has gone under the radar of the U.S. citizens....so far. We should be afraid that like shooting a BB gun at an elephant, he might ignore you for a while, but eventually you’re probably going to get stomped. Luckily for Paul, he can just sail away in his foreign ships and let the Canadians he loves so much suffer with the consequences of a trade war. Unfortunately for the rest of us, we’ll be stuck with the aftermath of 12 years of Liberal anti-Americanism.

Finding an enemy to focus the public’s anger against is nothing new. Many totalitarian regimes have used scapegoats in the past to solidify or cling to power. Nothing appeases the peasants like having someone else for them to focus their discontentment on. A little alarming to see it tried here though.

At worst for the Liberals, polls suggest a minority Conservative government that likely wouldn’t last more than a couple of years. With the level of scandal and corruption we’ve seen the last 12 years, if the Liberals have to spend a little time in the opposition penalty box, you’d think they’d consider that getting off lucky. They spend this time promising to increase funding to news providers, make billions of dollars of promises elsewhere, and surprise, another majority Liberal government in the next election? “We” fall for this stuff every time? I just don't understand what are the Liberals so afraid of that they are resorting to this stuff? Are there a few more rocks with scandals underneath that the Libs are afraid of being overturned if they aren’t running things?

[silverback]

If the Income Trust scandal ever gets truly investigated, it appears there may be a lot of interesting people that made a lot of money that day. It stays out of the news as long as we go round and round trying to decide what can be done with the definition of marriage.

[cowman]

I would suspect old Ralph Goodale might be sweating that one and hoping no one brings it up?
I wonder if after the holidays the opposition parties might start to get down and dirty about things like this...or will Martin and his media masters be able to keep the public focussed on trivial garbage like the fruitcakes and guns?

[blackjack]

...and don't forget the easy target of blaming the yanks when we have so many pathetic govt policies of our own... maybe one could be our lack of policy on agriculture...

[ivbinconned]

I think I can tell you what the Liberals and NDP are so scared of. A conservative minority government that lives with the blessing of the bloc.

They have more (maybe) in common than is widly known or understood.

Harper I believe would like for the federal government to devulge itself of powers that were origonaly provincial ares of jurisdiction...Quebec would approve!

Harper ...with quebec and 6 other provinces could float a constitutional ammendment to "reconfederate" (triple E, etc) the country and the Liberals and Ontario could scream to high heavens but would be powerless in the process...THIS is what the Liebrano's fear...the turning back of Trudouopia!

Its going to get dirty!

[charliep]

For anyone who wants the read the actual text of the meeting, it is at:

http://www.wto.org/english/thewto_e/minist_e/min05_e/min05_e.htm

[Horse]

Farmranger why is it bashing to point out that they are colecting tarrif on softwood that is against the nafra or that BSE is realy just BS or that they are in Iraq for thier own intrests and no one elses
.
If we complain about the libs in ottawa are we bashing or trying to make a point. As for the yanks and trade do you think they come here and take 350 bill more than we take from them just to be nice or mabey with over 300 mill people that like to live high mabey they need all that trade?
And yes I dont agree with most of thier forien policy butr I dont think I am bashing them moreso I am just stating my humble opinion.

[FarmRanger]

Well Horse, I am not sure where to start. Explaining macroeconomics obviously won't mean much to you if you think that having a trade surplus with the U.S. is a bad thing for us.

Think of it this way, if I sell you $256 dollars worth of stuff that I produce, then I have your money to buy what I want with it, and you have the goods I produced. Suppose I start calling you nasty names and you decide you don’t want my $256 dollars worth of stuff. I get to either find somewhere else to sell it for a lower price, or stop producing altogether. My wife gets mad because we can’t afford the $190 I used to spend for a night out every month at your bowling alley anymore. My kid who used to make the stuff I sold to you is now sitting on the couch watching T.V., and not eating the bread I used to buy from my brother down the road for $66, but can’t afford now, (which means my brother can’t afford to buy my stuff I used to sell to you either). We are all poorer for our actions, but I’ll be worse off than you if we stop buying each others goods and services. In addition, you’d feel it a lot less than me because you’ve got a lot more money than me to start with. (Ranger economics 101) Now, multiply the numbers I used by 1 billion and you have something resembling the trade we had with the U.S. in 2004. We sold $256 billion to, and purchased 190 billion worth of goods and services from the U.S. in 2004.

I’m not going to defend U.S. tariffs on lumber, or BSE, other than to point out that, we don’t really have much to say about BSE that wouldn’t be hypocritical in light of the Liberal government’s ban of Brazilian beef a few years ago. It’s pretty obvious that the Liberals have damaged relations with the U.S. as well as Brazil, which has very real consequences for Canadians.
Disagree with another country’s foreign policy all you want, just make sure you understand the reasons for doing so, and be prepared to defend those reasons if you’re going to post them here. I also have the right to be upset by the cheap shots for political gain that can have the very real potential to be harmful to my country.
Please don’t take offense to my post Horse, none is intended. Even if I disagree with them, your opinions are as important as anyone else’s. I guess I’m just tired of the destructive political rhetoric that’s been going on, and I suppose I’m getting a little testy! ....Maybe a nice night out at the bowling ally with my wife ;-)

[FarmRanger]

Just came across this:

http://www.stephentaylor.ca/archives/000495.html

Stephen Taylor makes a pretty good case for claiming that the spat with the Bush administration was orchestrated and that the Liberals were planning to use America bashing in their re-election strategy all along.

They were planning all along to try to tick our largest trading partner off?!?!

[cowman]

Ivebinconned: I think you hit the nail on the head! Harper had a pretty interesting day, yesterday in Quebec?
He basically help out the olive branch to Quebec and said our concerns are your concerns?
I believe the Conservatives and the BLOC could get one hell of a lot done in a minority situation? Divest the federal government of a whole whack of programs that in reality belong to the provinces?
Move this country away from this strong "federal" system that obviously isn't working? Into a state where it truly is a federation of ten provinces instead of one big corrupt federal system catering to Toronto, Montreal, Ottawa!
I believe this is the only way this country can survive...otherwise we will dissolve into several states....most absorbed by the USA?