Bio gas plant

[cowman]

Today in Red Deer the bio gas plant proposal for Red Deer County is going to go before council. This is the final report on all the surveys, testing, research, and proposals for getting it built! This is open to the public.
Next week the stakeholders sit down and decide on where they want to go with this and how they want to do it. Seven seperate companies are putting forth proposals on construction. This meeting is by invitation only...you had to put some money in to attend. I'll be there.
Now this will not be a government deal but a privately owned venture...although there definitely will be government money involved! Red Deer County will, in all probability be investing in this...as they have a serious garbage problem...and this might be part of a solution!
The initial plant will probably be a model for just about every other future plant in the west and it is expected to be a major tourist attraction!
It is helpful that the councillors of Red Deer County had the foresight to look to the future and committed the initial seed money to get the ball rolling? The city of Red Deer chose not to participate...which just goes to show how far they are behind on most matters! It has been close to two years to get here and hopefully construction can begin in 2006.

[countryguy]

I hope you guys are considering your local solution.

www.ortechteam.com

[wilagro]

cowman: Why doesn't it surprise me that Red Deer City is not participating?
Things haven't changed much I see. I lived n Red Deer for about twenty years and in all of that time never figured that city council was too progressive. For the most part they were super cautious and it cost them a fortune at times. Dr. Allard got plenty rich on council's shortsightedness. Also property owners surrounding the city found the city reluctant to pay what was asked 30 years ago and when it came time to develop these property owners really stuck it to the developers and the city.
Let them (the city) go on feeding their damned seagulls at their dump while the county develops the technology from their bio-digestors.

[wilagro]

Now the city is after the land in gasoline alley, hopefully the county has their ducks in a row because if there is an annexation applied for the Municipal Government Board could award all those lands to the city if it went to a Board hearing.

[cowman]

Well it was a fairly informative session. The results that came back from the testing were very informative. The province and feds have basically thrown up a few more roadblocks in regards to using packing house waste as well as limiting the selling of carbon credits. Carbon credits traded for $51/t on the Italian exchange yesterday. If it was possible to sell into that exchange this thing would be a complete no brainer? Unfortunately there is virtually no market for carbon credits within Canada!
The other huge roadblock is packing house waste? Cattle were always a problem due to the BSE thing but now they are restricting hog plant waste...in other words they want to put it in a landfill! Your government...at work for you!
Now despite all that...there is a fairly committed group willing to take a chance and go ahead with construction! I guess we'll see how it goes on the 16th when the rubber meets the road! If we lived in the US with the incentives they have there...it would be a go tommorrow! I suspect that is why they are building ethanol and bio deisel plants in the US right now...because their government supports these things and doesn't spend all their energy blocking them?
As far as the "war" in Red Deer County, well it is heating up! If you actually look at what is happening, the city broke an agreement by trying to annex 8 quarters...an agreement they signed last year! When the county refuses to let them break it they took all these silly actions to punish them! It really is a comedy of fools...the biggest fool being the mayor of Red Deer! The same fool who is proposing a 12% tax hike this year! That's what happens when you get a museum curator trying to run a city...instead of a businessman!

[cowman]

One other thing: The county council seemed very receptive to the bio gas proposal and indicated they would be interested in pursuing some form of investment in the project. Part of the problem is that the city of Red Deer has banned the county from using the Red Deer landfill, as part of their little snit over being denied annexation of county lands. This will in all probability raise the $475,000 garbage budget significantly! The county had already instigated a recyling project and a bio digestor could reduce their overall costs.
Just before the bio gas presentation the manager of the Red Deer municipal airport gave a presentation on upgrading the airport to international standards. It would cost $1.6 million. West jet would move in the day it achieved international status and Canada customs would set up shop. Sort of a no brainer there right? Well it turns out the province won't chip in a dime and co-owner(city of Red Deer) won't either! So once again it is up to the County of Red Deer to carry the ball!
The city of Red Deer has to be about the most backwards thinking council in Canada, but I don't know what is the problem with the province? I mean we have two cabinet ministers here...and they can't get a nickel to upgrade the airport? What is with that?

[cakadu]

The cost to upgrade the Red Deer Airport would be $16 million rather than 1.6 so it is a fair chunk of change. Also, I'm not sure about the international status as Merv Philips was talking about becoming on par with the airports at Medicine Hat and Lethbridge and other similar sized cities.

Under the Municipal Government Act any municipality has the right to grow and the Intermunicipal plan between the City and the County is a fairly complex one.

Without the carbon credit incentives and the green tax credits it makes it very hard to get any kind of return on investment from a biodigester - at this stage of the game. The European Union is further ahead on this because of the credit payments that are being made. At the current cost of a biodigester, you don't make any money back on the investment - as it stands now.

It is my understanding that we haven't yet figured out a system for paying for carbon credits. I also understand that many didn't believe that carbon credits would trade prior to 2008.

After July 1st the County has to figure out what to do with all of that waste. So far I haven't heard too much about it. Even if the biodigester were given the green light today, it would still take many months before it was up and functional. What do we do with our garbage in the interim? It's not that the county hasn't known about this issue for a very long time because they have. It is now becoming critical.

[cowman]

Well maybe I heard the numbers wrong...I was shooting the breeze at the back of the room with another guy...but Phillips was talking about Canada customs locating there.
Now the inter municipal developement plan might be complicated, and hey I only know what I read in the papers but the agreement was the city wouldn't cross highway II? Is that wrong? Why have they been printing all those maps showing what the agreement was? Is the county lying to us?
I will agree the county was slack doing something about the garbage situation. One of the reasons was they were trying to buy into the Red Deer landfill in a joint venture deal? The city only rebuffed them when the annexation thing was turned down.
The county has bought land for one transfer site south of Leons in the Gasoline Alley Business park. I believe 5 more transfer sites are in the works? The garbage will be trucked to either Stettler, Coronation or Beaver or Sturgeon county! Obviously this is going to be extremely expensive?
On the bio gas plant: First of all there is a "secret" heavy hitter(actually two, maybe three) whose interests are more in the PR of this thing than making any money! When a corporation has a budget of $200 million for alternate energy $6.5 million isn't much of a problem? Also at least two farm groups are looking at a cheaper solution after being in contact with a Minnesota dairy farmer(1000 cows)? He has a bio digestor up and running for less than $1 million and it is working very well? Of course this would be a bare bones unit unlikely to attract any government or corporation support.

[joedales]

The Europeans are leading with electricity generated by using animal manure to generate bio gas...the electricity is purchased from the farmer at a profitable price and the investment is made by private companies...