PC Leadership

[Vader]

I don't usually ask questions that I don't support. The question that I will ask will be at the committee level and will be dealt with as are all other issues, with proper deliberation. You get nowhere by springing something on the whole board out of the blue.

[parsley]

Vader,

Proper deliberation, as I recall Board tactics, usually includes a minimum 10 year study, and not necesarily in the Yoga position.

The Board is well aware of the licensing issue. If they aren't, they shouldn't be on the Board. They are either willing to make concessions, or face the ramifications of doing nothing. That's where it is at.

I commend you if you bring some conciliatory measures forward, Vader, and I recognize your negotiation position as a ray of intelligence at the Board level. Are you the only Monopolist who can recognize the vertigo resulting from the downward spiral the CWB is in?

If this is just another CWB stalling tactic, the timeline will be triggered by impatience.

Either way, the farmers are not going away.The Board might.

Parsley

[WRAPper]

.

"The glove fits, and he must commit," said Syms,


That was a quote from one of Mannings organizers in todays Calgary Sun.
I'm thinking we may have found the true killer of Ron and Nicole.
By god OJ IS innocent it was Preston Manning.

[WRAPper]

The moccasin telegraph says that some ranchers in the foothills are encouraging Manning because they are fed up with resource companies wanting to drill in the eastern slopes and Dinning scares the heck out of them.

[cowman]

I don't know how smart that is? Preston wasn't always a career politician you know...he actually worked in the oil industry as a consultant prior to creating Reform!
Some of those old boys on the "eastern slopes" are kind of funny? They've been sucking the government tit for so long they actually think they own that leased land! But whether they own it or not...the Alberta citizen usually owns whats under it...and we have the right to have access to our property!
Yep its pretty, but so what? If there is billions of dollars of oil and gas sitting there, we the people of Alberta have a right to utilize it! These ranchers think they have a God given right to control paradise...at our expense! They need some tough old leader to show them reality?

[cowman]

cowman, I do think that this land is owned for the most part, and one concern they have is for the loss of prairie rangeland, there isn't much of it left.

The Pekisko Ranchers Group is made up of some pretty well heeled ranchers, and they aren't going to give up without a battle. They are currently involved in an EUB hearing.

I don't necessarily think that all Albertans have the right to **** and pillage every square inch of the province in the name of resource extraction.

I don't know if you have ever driven around the Wabumun area, but for miles the landscape looks like moon craters. Companies say they are reclaiming it but the productive value of the land is certainly a lot less and it is an eyesore. We need to have a balance in all this somewhere.

[cowman]

Well I wasn't saying anyone should be allowed to **** and pillage, but we do have the right to access our resource...in a responsible way? I fail to see why a bunch of millionaire cattlemen are any different than the rest of us peasants?
The Alberta government has not raised the bar high enough, in the past and probably needs to do a lot more...although I think it is getting better simply because the companies need to do a better job or they will run into oppostion?
We're still thrashing out the synergy group down here in Red Deer County! There has been strong opposition from the local surface rights group...which makes me question if they are really interested in solutions as opposed to confrontation! It's pretty hard to be indignant when your concerns are met!

[cowman]

In my view the responsible way to extract resources is to ensure that the environment is well looked after, and in the case of significant environmental issues such as native prairie grass, the vast majority of the area is left untouched. We need to leave something for other generations.

[cowman]

And emerald I think the companies were proposing some pretty tough environmental practices? Like pad drilling and less surface disturbance...as well as replanting native grass?
Bottom line is a lot of these old boys have more money than they can ever spend and like to play cowboys, so what do they care if the company pays them a few thousand bucks? What are they going to do...throw it on top of the pile!
This is all a bunch of BS! The oil belongs to the people of Alberta and no one should be able to stop us from getting our property? No one else can?
And in reality the so called "heritage grassland" of the eastern slopes was just the scrub land that wasn't fit to farm? I'd be more concerned with how they are paving over 2 feet of good black loam than a bunch of scrub land!
Sorry I'm just a farmer at heart...and don't think much of garbage land...no matter how "pretty" it is!

[cowman]

If you ever have the opportunity to attend a presentation by Dr. Brad Stelfox cowman you would see the impact all industries have on the land base in the province.
He uses a series of overlays in a power point presentation that take us back 100 years and forward to the present.

The impact on the land of not only leases but lease roads, logging cut lines, SML's for gravel extraction etc., plus the growth of urban centres has made a huge impact on the landbase.

You don't realize just how much until you see the 'big picture'.

As far as the right to the resources goes, I do think the resources belong to the people of Alberta but at the rate the money is being spent there will be nothing left for future generations so they may as well have some of the environmentally significant areas protected now.

I realize that the ranchers in the Pekisko Group are pretty well heeled but they have a right to try and preserve lands they feel are 'special'. The battle they are waging will help other landowners across the province so the fact that they have the money to do battle isn't a negative thing as far as I can see.
The proposed Integrated Land Use strategy will likely take away that right from landowners, and wlll also take away some of the zoning authority from municipalities if it is passed.

It not all about resources in this province, its about people too, and as I have said previously there has to be a balance.

[cowman]

I do realize this whole land use thing is a tricky problem. The fact is I truly doubt much will really change?
Basic fact: If the oil/gas is there sooner or later it is going to be exploited? The cities are going to continue to expand on good farmland?
I truly don't think that will change?
Agriculture has become such a dog that it can, and will, be sacrificed for whatever comes along, whether that is recreation, industrial,resource extraction or residential! The "save the farmland" cry is a complete and utter joke, designed mainly to keep the peasants toiling away in the field! Just my opinion.

[cowman]

The proposed Integrated Land Use Strategy will see an agency like the NRCB make final decisions regarding land use issues in Alberta.

The province will zone the lands and indicate where agriculture will expand, where resource extraction will take place and where the forest areas will be protected and where recreation will be allowed eg: ATV's.

The average citizen will have less to say if this strategy becomes legislation because zoning will be removed from municipalities or at least major zoning will, so it will be further removed from the public.

[cowman]

Well I might suggest that could be a good thing? One thing about this government, love them or hate them, they promote business and get things done? Now not saying they are perfect or anything...but they do create an atmosphere where business can flourish?
Consider this: If we had some sort of wingding government in place projects like the tarsands would have been dead in the water...and probably the coalbed? The people of Alberta have invested a lot in the tarsands and it is starting to really pay off!
My own feeling is no area should be a sacred cow! Drill the whole darned province...including the national and provincial parks! Let the oil and the good times roll!
And I think the majority of Albertans might just agree?

[cowman]

thats where you and I will not agree cowman. We do need to preserve something for future generations.
Companies that have no real stake in the future of Alberta, with the exception of making their millions, should not be allowed to ruin the landscape for those who wish to enjoy it now and in the future.
Don't forget that one of our main industries is tourism, and if your way happened to be the choice of government what would tourists come to see ? Lease roads,and pump jacks ???

[cowman]

Well I think lease roads and pumpjacks are very interesting, in fact much more interesting than a bunch of useless mountains...but maybe thats just me!LOL
I don't think it has to be like Oklahoma in the early 1900s with a derrick every few feet? We do have the technology to extract the resources with a low disturbance?
Now your average person goes to the national parks and sees paradise, but paradise to one man might be something else completely different? My paradise, is my own little place and I can't think of anywhere else I'd want to be! And yet it is okay for the province to say it is okay to drill in my paradise...so why not in the parks or on a bunch of poor grassland? The ironic thing about a lot of these "wealthy foothill" ranchers is they got their money to buy their ranches out of the oil field? The Turner Valley Ranch and the OH come to mind?