wiebul ludwig

[cowman]

And I will say, here is where I have problems with a guy like Ludwig? He is concerned with his rights being violated? What about that girl? Where is her life? Now I don't know anything about her but she did have a right to live her life...in my humble opinion!
Whether he pulled the trigger or one of his henchmen did, doesn't really matter? Someone, through carelessness or ignorance or hate...killed that girl and took away all her time under the sun! I truly believe who ever did that will someday answer for that...whether in this world or in the next? I don't believe murderers ever walk away free?...never.

[coppertop]

I don't advocate murder cowman, but self defense is a different matter. Lord knows the laws of the country don't protect the innocent.

[Horse]

A couple of points Cowman you say your father was an firearm instructor ? was he like the Mountie / firearm instructor in I believe it was medecine hat that shot himself in the foot or the mountie that loosed a couple rounds in the Red Deer police building a few yrs ago? My point is anyone can and does make mistakes and that just because you have been trained it dosent nessarly make you smart.
As for Ludwig what did he go to jail for ? breaking the law right and the mounties broke several laws so why wernt they in jail also. Then there is the oil co and thier actions, I cant say for sure but if my kids were sleeping out in the yard in a tent and some poor little rich kids were driving around in the middle of the night I may be tempted to fire off a shot or two but I sure wouldnt be trying to kill anyone but when you do somethings sometimes there is conciquences, its to bad it turned out the way it did.
The rosco afair is another case where they were on his land iligaly and were snooping to find this so called Growop yes there was a few plants and that is ilegal also but the cops are useing every means posible to cover up a bloched and very pooly planed arest to cover thier own asses. I didnt know Jim Roscoe personaly but I do Know how the police basicaly harresed him from young to the point of makeing him into what he become.That dont say anyone has the right to kill someone just because they dont like them but there is more to the story than the cops are telling or the media,
WE have the damdest secret police force since the SS and god help you if you get on thier wrong side.

[coppertop]

HORSE, for God sake, Jim Rozco terrorized his community, preyed on kids and other things too dispicable to mention.
To lay blame in the RCMP is WRONG !!! He stalked officers to their homes, taunted them every chance he got and when they did get enough on him to put him behind bars the judge slapped his wrists.

His place was a chop shop, and a grow up as well. Are police supposed to turn a blind eye to these things. Do you ever wonder how many young lives were screwed up due to the drugs he grew and sold ?????

[Horse]

I think you got all your info from the media ,asuming that 1 plant is to many just how many do you think he grew,and do you realy believe 1 man could terrorize the whole detachment with all thier resources? And the chop shop how many vehicles was there ,this was just bad police work.

[coppertop]

Horse, I happen to know many people in the community where he lived. His own brothers are heart broken over what happened, and they have come out publically saying how horrible he was.

A very good friend of mine heard on the radio about four RCMP officers not responding etc., and the first thing she said was Jim Rozco....she has known him since she was a little kid and knew what he was capable of.

I think the police made some grave errors and it cost them their lives, but making an error does not mean they should have been shot.

Within fifteen miles from my home there have been two grow- op/chop shop operations uncovered in the past year and a half, this stuff is serious business, and these guys aren't playing tiddly winks .


I have seen in my owm community the heartbreak families are going through because some jerk got their child hooked on dope.....the only good thing that came out of Rochfort Bridge on March 3 of last year is Rozco doing himself in. Saved the taxpayers one hell of a lot of money !!!

[cowman]

Horse: I would say the two examples you quoted are good reasons to have gun control? Two irresponsible people who never should have been allowed to own a gun?
This isn't the wild west where you shoot first and ask later!
"Accidents" happen...not deliberate stupidity with a gun!
Rosco was a criminal and a sexual predator. He obviously had some mental problems as well as a very violent temper? Is that the kind of person who should be allowed to have a gun?
The mounties aren't perfect, but I like to believe they are decent people trying to do their jobs of upholding the law? Those four young men did not deserve to be shot down like dogs by a deranged madman.

[FarmRanger]

Question? Is it legal to have guns in those racks that sit up in the back window of a pickup truck? My neighbor has guns in his, and he may not be a Ludwig or Roscoe, but he definately isn't real stable either.

Just curious if he is breaking any law by carrying guns that way?

[coppertop]

As far as I know the guns can be transported as long as they are not loaded, but there may be some stipulation that they must be out of sight if the vehicle is not occupied eg: [parked], I am not sure of that.
Unless the individual has threatened someone with a gun he is allowed to own them, and as happened in the Rozco case even when they have been found to be unstable they can own an arsenal!!

There are lots of coconuts that own guns and sometimes they are pretty scary. My wacky neighbour is scarier out on the road in his manure spreading truck than anyone else around here with a gun as far as I know.

[kpb]

roscoe had a bad past but I have to agree with horse that he was not running a grow-op. Even the police admitted later on that they found only a couple of plants, not a grow-op that would be used for selling.

kpb

[coppertop]

The information I have heard from our local RCMP was that there were enough plants and associated materials to consider it a grow-op.
The RCMP are faced with entering hostile premises on a daily basis somewhere in this country, whether they find a grow up, an arsenal of illegal guns or chop shops etc., doesn't really matter, its the fact that in many cases they are dealing with people that have a long history of either violence or threats of violence. The situation in Mayerthorpe just compounded the fact that judges being lax have allowed people like Jim Rozco to continue their suspect activities and be a threat to society vs being incarcerated.

[Horse]

Copertop just how big of a jail would you like ,man if you put everyone in jail that broke the laws there wouldnt be enough people to look after them all.
As for the local RCs telling you a story ,they are still trying to figure who to hang this mess on, and after all they are just human and they sure do look after themselves.
And no they shouldnt have been shot no one should but the basic premis of policing is to intimidate well sooner or later there is going to be those that have had enough and will go off the deep end. Enough said.