wiebul ludwig

[cowman]

coppertop:They use it because they choose to? Would you be happier if they drank themselves to death at age 32?
Yes there are laws against illegal drugs...just like there were laws against illegal liquor? In fact when Alberta was "dry", marijuauna was not illegal! In 1938 it suddenly became illegal and really had nothing to do with how harmful it might be, but a concerted effort by the news print industry to get rid of the hemp competition!
Marijuauna is not completely illegal? There are many people who get a license to grow it for medical purposes? HMMM...its good medicine, better than anything else for pain relief? Ask someone suffering from MS?
The concept that marijuauna is a "gateway drug" has been thoroughly disproved. The only ones claiming that marijuauna leads to harder drugs is the religious right in the Bush administration, with zero facts to back that up! Its like "oh the herion addict smoked mj once", but in fact he probably drank milk too...and that doesn't make milk a gateway drug!
Illegal drugs will never be stamped out. The trick is to reduce the risk as much as possible? Its called harm reduction? It does not make sense to create a bigger and more harmful problem over a smaller problem?
Meth and crack are pretty ugly and I'm not condoning the use of them. But I sure don't see wrecking some 17 years olds life because he smoked a joint with his buddies! Totally inappropriate punishment for a bit of fun that hurts nobody.

[cowman]

One more thing before I get to work...The senate, that sober second look at government, recommended that pot be legalized and regulated? Now are these people all idiots or something? We might consider them political hacks, but the fact is many of these senators were the leaders in our country and very capable people?
The other thing is this: If everyone who ever smoked pot was jailed...you'd need to have the biggest prison system in the world? Come on everyone smoked pot in the late sixties/seventies! There was a popular saying back then "Even the Pope smokes dope"!
Maybe you all led a very sheltered life or something?

[coppertop]

cowman, I don't know what you call a sheltered life, but I do not apologize for the life I choose to lead which happens to be one free of substances that provide a 'crutch' to deal with life !!! I am no teetotaller but it would be a real stretch to even consider me a social drinker. If leading a sheltered life means that I don't snort, smoke, etc., then I am proud to have lead and continue to lead a sheltered life.

In our local paper last week there was a letter from the mother of a 14 year old girl. Her daughter had been invited to a birthday party at a friends home, the party was to be 'supervised' by the parents of the hostess. The 'supervising parents' provided beer for the kids, and the mother's letter to the paper went in to detail about how she and her husband were trying their level best to encourage their daughter to abstain from alcohol and drugs, and hopefully make good choices later in life. Of course the kid had a few beers at the party because all her friends were doing so....., but not to worry, the party was 'supervised, so none of the kids could get hurt if they got drunk !!!

Maybe in your view the girl in question was leading a sheltered life, in my view she is being raised by parents who care a lot about her and don't want to end up seeing her in a coffin because of some dumb choice she made as a kid.

[FarmRanger]

I’m a little confused here maybe? Cowman said “Whenever the government declares something "illegal", you just created a wealth source for the predators in our society?” If you just were talking about legalizing marijuana, wouldn’t the drug pushing “predators” still be out there pushing the ones that aren’t legal?
So, do we legalize every drug including crystal meth? Would that get rid of the illegal drug trade? It might force prices down and reduce their profits (assuming that the level of taxation was less that what the pushers charge now, a doubtful proposition given the current tax levels on tobacco and alcohol).

You guys are assuming that druggies would only steal to get a fix from their pusher, but what if the pusher is the government? Either you’re going to see cheap drugs from government, or highly taxed expensive drugs, that they won’t have the money for anyway?

What kind of mixed messages do we want to send our kids? Drugs are bad, but not the ones the government sells, because that money goes into your rehab after you’re hooked? In the end, I am just questioning what would be accomplished, because unless (even if?) you throw the pandora’s box wide open, there’s still going to be an illegal drug trade, and I just can’t see it reducing drug abuse, so what’s the point?

[coppertop]

Those who legally cannot access these 'legalized' drugs and wish to consume them will no doubt turn to pushers to access their supply. I highly doubt they will do so at a bargain basement price !!
I don't think we need to worry much about this entire issue because the government in place at this time has no intention of legalizing drugs of any sort and certainly are of the view that those who break laws should be treated as criminals.

If anyone thinks that it should not be illegal to smoke marijuana or have it in their posession, I would suggest they try and get across the US border with a little stash, they would soon find out what happens when you break the laws in that country or in many others for that matter.

Mind you, to quote cowman, maybe all the law makers have led sheltered lives !!!

[kpb]

I'll try to get this message on the right thread just so you guys don't think I've been smoking up. lol. I've got to agree with cowman, once again. Most people that I know who were in high school in the late 60's and early 70's tried marijuana with no adverse effects. That includes lots of politicians and leaders in our community.
Also, again as cowman has said, that old saw about smoking marijuana leading to harder drug use has been repeatedly debunked in studies as has the old myth about smoking marijuana being addictive. So why not legalize it and tax the sale? At least the government will get some revenue from selling it (like booze) save some money by not having to jail and prosecute people and not ruin lives that could be otherwise gainfully employed.
Now as to why people take drugs. That is a very tough question, coppertop. Why do people eat too much? Or sky-dive? Or ride motorcycles? People want to experience different things I think and have different means of relaxation.
As far as addictive drugs are concerned, I think these drugs mostly appeal to people who have what they perceive to be hopeless situations in their lives. I'm no expert on this but one of the reasons I advocate legalization of all drugs is that I believe it is the best way to regulate the use of these drugs, treat the people who want treatment and keep them out of the hands of the young. Although the proceeds of sales would be taxed, the total cost would be a fraction of what these people have to pay now. Hence the high crime rates that result.

kpb

[coppertop]

It is a sad day when people are at the bottom of the pit and think the need to turn to any kind of drugs, legal or illegal to get through it.

Life is tough, and drugs of any sort are not going to make tough times easier, all they accomplish is helping people avoid facing what is going on and dealing with it in a rational frame of mind.

kpb I am glad all the folks that you knew that smoked it up have turned out okay, I know a few around this community that have been spaced out since the 70's !!!! LOL

[cakadu]

Just an observation, but in the Netherlands where you don't get busted for possessing and smoking recreational amounts, there isn't rampant drug abuse or escalating drug use. If the theory that smoking any kind of drugs leads to harder stuff, then wouldn't that "hypothesis" be proven there?

I believe that people turn to alcohol and/or drugs to escape from life. Some people can experiment with them and decide that it is not for them, others can't. I also believe that how problems get handled in the home is a significant influence on how kids handle problems in their own lives.

One of the things that makes me most upset is how we label kids. Remember back in the 60's and 70's when approximately 5% of kids were hyperactive? Fast forward to the mid-80's onward and more than 30% of kids are labelled with ADD or ADHD. Where did this sharp increase come from? Kids are put on Ritalin and other similar drugs in order to keep the symptoms under control. Of course they'll be under control - it is an amphetamine and they are stoned. Would these same parents go to the street corner and buy drugs there?

There are definitely kids who have these disorders and drugs do help. What I get concerned about is the fact that kids are being told from a young age that if you can't cope you can take drugs to feel better. Does the fact that drugs come by prescription make them any better?

We have more people that are stressed out, depressed, unable to cope than we have ever had and the prescriptions just keep rolling out. The amount of Prozac, Zanax and all the related generic drugs that get sold in a year is mind-boggling.

Bottom line is how are peace officers supposed to be able to tell when one is stoned on something legal or illegal?

[cowman]

I believe in Switzerland they basically decided to give heroin addicts free dope and voila...no more crime from heroin addicts!
Don't we basically do that now with methadone clinics?
If it was possible to go back and catch everyone who ever smoked some dope and then charge them for doing so, what percent of the population would be guilty?
Young people have to find their own way to be healthy individuals...in my opinion. What sort of person do you raise when they are little clones of yourself? Every one of us in on a journey and no one has the right to live your life for you! You make your choices, you screw up and you live with the consequences...that is how you grow and learn? Otherwise what are you, but a living robot?
Some of the so-called legal drugs are no better than the illegal ones? There are a lot of "legal" junkies out there, with the biggest legal junkies being alcohol abusers?
And coppertop you are very correct when you say the government we have in place is anti-drugs...well illegal ones anyway...and yep definitely the present US administration is anti-illegal drugs! So yes we should expect to waste billions more on a problem that is, in the big picture, very minor!
My own belief is the police should be concentrating on crime, like stealing and murder, instead of a business transaction between a willing buyer and a willing seller? Just my opinion.

[spudchucker]

Smoking Dope gives people the munchies. A beef producers coop could produce a vending machine for jerky, sausage, etc to be installed whereever dope is sold. A solution to the beef producers woes!