Bitumen and Ed?

[Horse]

I was going to reply but I guess I had better get my pedigree updated before I say anything IBC seems a little sensetuive today . If it is just because you cant vote I am sure Ted could find you a ballot if It is all that important.
Coppertop I do have to wonder about your statement about fighting with ottawa as I rember that was Ralphs first defence for everything and I may be reading you wrong but I think I would bet you are a tory,so why would that be wrong now and not for the past 14yr.

[coppertop]

horse, Ralph's first defense was fighting with a LIBERAL government in Ottawa. Why would we need to fight with a Conservative government when the Alberta MP's are back here campaigning for the leadership candidate that is running on his Less Ottawa More Alberta theme ? Exactly how is he going to fight with the very same people that have helped him get into the premier's office if he wins??? Something like biting the hand that feeds you I would think. I don't know what you think about Quebec being given Nation within a Nation status but it makes my blood boil. We have spent billions in this country trying to keep Quebec in Canada, now we give them official special status, and Morton praises Harper for doing so well in Quebec.

Is he going to demand Nation within a Nation status for Alberta, or is he going to circle the wagons of BC,Saskatchewan and Alberta and shut his compadre's in Ottawa out ????

[cowman]

I wonder why all those Alberta MPs are coming back to help Morton? Is it because they see him as someone they can work with?
I think a lot of people never have understood the Harper agenda? It always was about giving more power back to the provinces...and thus saving this country from the slide into breaking up? Maybe you thought he was just another Paul Martin/Jean Chretien who didn't like gays or something?
Make no mistake here...Ted Morton and Stephen Harper are on the same page!
Now if Harper wins a majority next time out...then that is just peachy...they can work together to build a stronger country built on less federal government and more provincial responsibility?
The Liberal convention is generating a lot of interest? Could be Iggy? Could be Bob Rae? The chances of the Liberals being back in power look very good...pretty soon?
Now without a doubt I am sure a Jim Dinning or Ed Stelmach will have few problems rolling over for the new Liberal leader...Ted Morton won't! So if you want harmony and peace on the federal/provincial front...don't vote for Morton! Just get out your checkbook!
Can you really see Ed going up against Iggy? Or Rae for that matter? They'd eat him for breakfast.

[coppertop]

If the Liberals elect a leader that has a lot of Ontario and Quebec support I am afraid they will form a minority government next time around. Klein tried to stand up to Ottawa more than once, and was shut down,Morton won't have any better chance, as long as Albeta has the booming economy that looks great to Ontario and Quebec !!!

Is Ed tough, perhaps you have forgotten when he publically threatened to fire Murray Smith, our MAN in Washington, if he didn't resign his directorship of a resource company. Murray resigned in short order !!!!

I checked Morton's policy on private health care, he is proposing to allow people to purchase insurance for non emergency services.....pretty scary when you consider what isn't an emergency !!!

His proposal to opt out of the Canada Pension Plan certainly concerns people who are nearing retirement and don't know what will happen to their pension, it certainly would have been helpful to have more concrete information, not just some verbage about opting out.

Ed, on the other hand, proposes an Alberta Pension Plan running in tandem with CPP. He has had some fairly extensive advice on the mechanics of such a plan and I like the thought of young people starting out in the workforce being able to have two sources of pension income, vs one which isn't enough to pay the utility bills for most people !

[cowman]

I'm not so sure Mortons plan was much different than Eds? Basically yes we are opting out of the Canada pension plan...but the feds have a $60 billion dollar pension deficit in ALBERTA! In other words all the money we have sent in CPP payments over the years...really isn't there...and never was! However the federal government would still be obliged to pay that out to people who contributed...unless they wanted the whole rotten pyramid scheme to collapse?...it might anyway...
Now I hope Eds idea of another pension premium isn't a carbon copy of the Canada Pension Plan? Nothing like having two scams going on at the same time!
My old mother gets about three or four pensions: CPP, old age, veterans, and I think the widows pension? Now my father left her in pretty good shape and she has a very good annuity/investment income. She told me the government claws back every penny from her "pensions" and she just wished they would keep it! Nothing more than a bunch of extra paperwork!

[coppertop]

I know of one family member whose income was below the poverty line. she was collecting CPP, plus a widow's pension. She got a pretty good job, but didn't receive a red cent from her employment until October of 2002. She had to relocete, rent a place to live, buy furniture etc. When she filed her 2002 income tax the government made her pay back every cent she had received that year in CPP, regardless of the fact that she didn't receive a penny until almost the end of the year.

[coppertop]

My understanding of Ed's proposed Alberta Pension is that it would be optional, and dollars invested would be invested by the government similar to the Heritage Trust Fund dollars, gaining the best possible return on investment.

[cowman]

Hmmmm...has the Heritage trust fund been a well managed good return fund? Maybe investing your own money, for your own retirement might be better? Maybe you could do better than the government, managing your own money?
Not sure about that one.

[ivbinconned]

Twenty years ago the Minister of Finance in Ontario commenting in the legislature on a question about the fact that Ontario had borrowed by far most of the funds in the CCP and had not even been paying the interest due gave this reply...
"why should we pay it back...who could make us"?

I became a western seperatist conservative libertarian right then and there. I wanted government to get out of my life. And Ontario to stop running the show.

The FACT that they would be swallowing up the contributions of Horse, Coppertop, Cowmans and Wilagrow and of course mine too was more than I could accept.

But no no, the encroachment never stops, with a stroke of a pen every duck and gopher shooter in western Canada became a big threat to the Ottawa politburo.

Watching the Liberal convention scares the heck out of me.

We need the strongest premiers we can get to defend the west from the every growing federal government that we are bound to get in the future.

Vote Ted

By the way Copper...I told (suggested)my kids make Ed their second choice.

Good luck to you...and lets remember to not put any man so high on a pedistal that he crushes us when he fails...as most assuredly they all do.

[cakadu]

It might interest some of you to know that even Ralph visited the Alberta pension thing twice during his tenure and both times the cost to implement and run it far outweighed any benefits that there would be. So much for creating our own.

Most times there are no really new ideas, just re-worked ideas brought up at a later time.