The end is nigh!

[coppertop]

cowman, glad to see you have ' seen the light' about our Premier. Now, before you yell at me, I realize he has to prove his ability, and his Cabinet has to do the same. He has inherited some issues, health care being one of them. I am glad he has suggested a high level meeting with health care professionals to see where the health care funds are being spent. I have a family member that is a nurse and she tells horror stories of the waste in the system in the hospital where she works, and it certainly isn't alone. I hope that a year from now our province is still enjoying a thriving economy and that our government has made some necessary changes .

I listened to Rutherford this morning, and the silly twit that was hosting the show was in a debate over non smoking bans in public buildings, apartment complexes etc. He felt it was a violation of individual rights and went as far as to say that no-body has ever been made ill by the smell of smoke!!! I would have loved to call in and ask just how much smoking costs the health care system....but I am getting off topic.

[cakadu]

Oh cowman, you make me laugh. Copper has been talking about the "instant" tories for weeks - I bring it up and get pounced on. It also makes me smile with the assumptions on who or what party I'm voting for.

It's always good to be able to smile.

[cowman]

Well Linda, you are right, I don't know how you vote and shouldn't assume how you might vote. I think the PC party of Alberta can just about appeal to anyone in the political spectrum!
Coppertop: I think Ed Stelmach is "doing the right thing" from a political perspective? The people of Alberta are still under the delusion that the healthcare system is sustainable! Actually it is...just as long as we want to spend the majority of our tax dollars on it! Its like Ralph said "How much is too much? Is 50% enough? Is 60% enough? is 70% enough? Where does it end?"!
Studying how we can save pennies in a flawed system is not really tackling the problem...but a smart political position! Sooner or later...we will have to deal with it?
BC is moving rapidly into a more "private" system. Ontario apparently is also?....and here...we study it?...I don't think it will work. Just my opinion.

[coppertop]

The influx of people to Alberta is one reason for increased costs in health care and education, but there has got to be a better way to deliver health care services.
Shortage of nurses is getting crucial in some areas of the province. Some nurses are working long past their retirement years because there is no-one to take their place.
I hope that whoever is in charge of any meeting of the minds, to see where efficiences are possible, isn't some slick consultant that puts their own spin on the issue. If changes are to be made, then the facts need to be on the table, along with possible solutions.

[cowman]

Politically just about any solution is going to be a tough sell? Look at anytime Klein tried to bring in any kind of change? The raging grannies and Friends of Medicare screamed "Americanization"! No real debate just fear mongering and pushing the right buttons!
I believe the Alberta governments portion of medicare came to around $11 billion last year? Schools and "higher education" got fairly close to $10 billion? On a $27 billion dollar budget...that doesn't leave a lot to keep up the infrastructure and run all the other government programs including social services?
Alberta healthcare costs are increasing faster than just about any other public sector and the cry is for "MORE, MORE, MORE"! Where does it end?
I don't know if there are gross inefficiencies in the healthcare system, but I sincerely doubt spending is going to go down? Until there is some personal responsibility placed on the user...I doubt it will happen?
Maybe I'm just an old redneck out of touch with reality...but I truly believe the tail can't wag the dog...or pretty soon the dog ain't worth a damn!!! Pretty well all the provinces oil and gas royalty money...goes to pay the Alberta portion of healthcare! Does that concern you? What happens if we go into a major bust? Will we be borrowing money just to pay the medicare bill?
Personally I believe government should pay for programs out of taxes? The oil/gas royalties should not be used for social programs or government operations! That money is the peoples money and should be either dispensed as a dividend or saved as a fund to be invested for the people of Alberta...not blown on government largesse! Just my opinion.

[coppertop]

There have been huge inefficincies in Health Care ever since the Health Regions were formed. I am basing that statement on what has gone on in this local area. A new hospital and a million dollars in reserves when the government decided to force the amalgamation of health boards to create health regions. Within a month, the reserves were moved from this facility to offset debt at another hospital and ever since this hospital has been given second rate equipment, etc. In fact if it weren't for the generosity of the local resource companies, and continuing fund raising by the Community Health Counsel, much of the modern equipment here wouldn't exist. Top heavy administration, huge costs for governance due to large Boards with members having to travel half a day to meetings etc. In this region Board members are paid so much an hour for travelling time plus mileage, then an honoraria per day, plus meals and of course accommodation.

The old hospital board used to hold their meetings in the evening after their workday.

One good thing about any initiative the government may take regarding health care is that the Premier has served on an old hospital board and knows how the system worked back then.

[cowman]

Now I have no idea if Stelmach intends to change the whole healthcare structure or not? I might suggest the system they have in place was "supposed" to be more effective? And without a doubt to reward their buddies? It was probably an excellent political tool...a way to take care of the party faithful?
And maybe scrapping that whole system will work if Ed Stelmach goes that way?
My own feeling is this: We have met the enemy...and it is us! Citizens have to have some personal responsibility for their own health...in fact for darned near every facit of their life?
A simple user fee, or a deductible cost on your healthcare insurance? How about that? Say a $20 user fee everytime you want to see a doctor? How about the idea you pay the first $1000 before healthcare kicks in?
I would bet either of those messages would reduce healthcare costs about 40%!
The old cry of what about the poor wouldn't apply, because they would be excempt from those provisions...just like they are excempt from healthcare premiums now!
What was the original purpose of universal healthcare? Wasn't it in fact a system so you wouldn't be totally wiped out financially if you got sick? It really wasn't created so lonely hypocondriacs could have a nice visit with the doctor!
Once upon a time Alberta sent you a cost breakdown of everything that happened to you healthwise? Did you ever check it out? Did you see what the doctor charged to remove a cast, or change a dressing, or whatever? Even though the nurse did the whole darned thing!
My doctor tried to "pad the bill" a couple of times and when I phoned Alberta healthcare and told them he put down several visits I'd never had the answer I got was "What do you care...it isn't costing you anything!"
Now that turned me purple!
Not long after that Alberta healthcare quit providing that information...I suppose too many doctors were being caught with their hand in the cookie jar!
The system is corrupt through and through...and there is no accountability! It really has little to do with healthcare and more to do with funneling money up to the doctors, administrators, and the beuracracy! It is a money machine!
If we want some accountability, hand the whole scam over to Mutual of Omaha and let them run it like a business instead of a place to put political hacks and friends!
There is an old saying "Theres no such thing as a free lunch"?... There really isn't. Just my opinion.

[wilagro]

cowman: Healthwise. I totally disagree with user fees. I totally disagree with turning the system over to private insurers of any description.

I totally disagree with the bloated 'so-called Health Authority' structure imposed upon us. Give us back elected local boards and the resources to run the system locally with co-ordination provincially without the heavy hand of direct gov't appointments of administrators and 'office sitters' who collect big wages and are not answerable to the public.

If we have a nurses shortage, then for gawd's train more of them. Open up the channels for nurses training that the Klein gov't closed years back.

[coppertop]

I agree with a fee to see a doctor, for certain reasons. I do NOT agree that anyone with cancer or a terminal illness should be expected to pay a fee each time they needed to see a doctor or receive some sort of medical service.

I doubt if the health regions will be done away with, but I think that the delivery of health care was much more streamlined when we had our local hospital boards, they hired the doctors and we seemed to have lots of them. Years ago doctors worked in emergency, now they don't want to. In fact, most of our local doctors have given up their hospital privileges because they do not want to have to work emergency.
The health care people receive when it is required is excellent, from what I hear. Thankfully, and knock on wood, I very seldom see a doctor or seek treatment. I have chosen to go the holistic route and pay the entire cost myself.

[cowman]

Coppertop: I go to the "witchdoctor" myself!...And also pay the whole shot!...I guess we are participating in that old "private medicare" that the lefties hate?
The Red Deer hospital emergency is a joke. Don't go there if you really need some immediate care...because you'll probably be dead by the time they get around to you!
Last fall the boy got his finger caught in a hydraulic wreck and busted it fairly bad/bone sticking out etc. It was an early Saturday morning so we wrapped a rag around it, he held it tight and I whipped him into the Innisfail hospital! As soon as he got there they called the on call doctor and he was there right away, got him fixed up real quick even though he obviously had been at a "late party...or real early one if you know what I mean"! Why you could have got drunk from the fumes! But still a good job and we were out the door in less than a half hour!
Now I am old enough to remember the pre-public healthcare days and I truly don't remember it being a big deal? My mother paid at the clinic and my Dad had some sort of insurance through the Alberta Wheat pool? When I was about eleven I broke both arms and was in the hospital for over a week. My mother was also in the hospital at the same time for some surgery for about ten days. I remember clearly my Dad paying $50 dollars at the desk when we went home...I think that was the deductable?
For everything in life, we pay? People shouldn't believe because they go to the doctor and don't have to get out the old wallet...that they aren't paying dearly for that service? One way or the other...YOU PAY! Are we paying too much?...I think so.
A $5 or even a $20 user fee is not too much! The doctor is soaking the government a lot more than that!
If a user fee deterred some people from going to the doctor for frivolous stuff...it would be well worth it!
Socialism is a very insideous thing? The whole idea that we can get something for nothing and get some other poor slob to pay for it, ruins the responsibility of human beings? This is why we get the attitude of "Its not my fault! I'm a victim!"
And then the BS starts? You must wear a seatbelt...well why? Because it might save you...well no...because it will cost the "collective healtcare system" too much money if you don't!
You mustn't smoke? Why? Because it will cost the "collective healthcare system" too much(which incidently is total BS)!
On and on it goes...freedoms taken away from the individual...for the good of the "majority" which usually means the majority of the "right kind of thinkers"!
Maybe we need to look at what this wonderful "collective society" is producing? Maybe we need to ponder if we should go back to a system of rights and responsibilities? Maybe the idea of "Root hog or die" would produce a better more independent, responsible citizen?...Just my opinion.

[coppertop]

And who knows better than anyone else what patients are abusing the system ? Doctors, of course !!!!

I visit my holistic practitioner every six weeks or so, pay $80.00 for an hour of her time, and any tests she may do. I go to a chiropractor when necessary, and try and look after myself. I have friends that are in at least one doctors office every week, are travelling to Edmonton to see specialists on a monthly basis and the only real health problems they have are likely caused by taking a handful of prescription meds two or three times a day. I do have a family doctor and go there when necessary which, thankfully, isn't very often.

I am not minimizing the fact that there are some very ill people, and sympathize with those who, no fault of their own, live with chronic illness every single day. Emergency medicine is crucial, but it is meant to be used in an emergency, not as a drop in for those who haven't bothered seeing their regular doctor.

[cowman]

And I might suggest "many" doctors are abusing the system...right along with there patients?
Lets face it medicare is a goldmine for the GP? Run those hypocondriacs through as fast as you can! Come back and see me next week? Come in in ten days and I'll take those stiches out? Come back in two months and I'll take that cast off? I want to see you again in two weeks!. I'll get you set up with a specialist...on and on it goes.

Of course he wants to see you again in a week!...its money in his pocket!
I sometimes wonder if a GP actually knows how to do anything anymore besides write out prescriptions?
I got really sick about seven years ago and realized if I kept messing with these clowns...I was going to be dead! The "witchdoctor" was worth more than the whole multi billion dollar healthcare system! Go figure?

[cakadu]

I'm sorry cowman, I don't agree with your assessment of all GP's. If and when I go to see my doctor, I don't get handed prescriptions by any stretch of the imagination. I realize that my doctor is quite likely in a minority but not everyone is out there to abuse the system. The abusers in any system make it bad for everyone.

I couldn't disagree more with your statements about smoking and seat belts. How many more times does it have to be proven that both of them can and do kill?

Red Deer emergency serves far more people than the Innisfail one does and any emergency is taken on how critical an injury is. Do you mean to tell me that someone having a heart attack or heart problems should sit and wait his/her turn because your boy got in their first with an albeit serious but non-life threatening injury?

Quite frankly, I would not be at all happy if the doctor came in reeking of booze - and would question the care I was getting. It's all a matter of perspective isn't it?

[cowman]

Well theres all kinds of things that can kill you, including being overweight or too much stress? The last time I checked we all had the right to go to hell however we choose? Or has that changed?
Do we really want "big Brother" deciding how we live?
Now unfortunately I can't smoke or drink...or I'd sure give them a whirl! And I only wear a seatbelt in town...although apparently the cops don't even bother handing out tickets anymore?
I don't care if someone is drunk, as long as they get the job done! Who knows what drugs anyone(including doctors) might be on? I'd sure rather have a competent drunk sew me up that somebody off in La-La land hopped up on anti depressants or anti-psychs or something!
I remember once in my younger days the safety guy on a rig was giving the tool push a lecture on his hard living ways and telling him how many brain cells he lost everytime he went out and got drunk? The push replied" Well Bobby, I can afford to lose them...you can't, so you'd better stay away from the bottle"! LOL