Coalition Government?

[cakadu]

Woah there silverback. I think you are reading far too much into my comments. I have not said whether or not I am in favor of the coalition or even support it. What I have said is that they have done nothing illegal or untoward - it is written into our constitution.

The present government hasn't brought anything evil, just haven't lived up to what they said they were going to do. In fact, what they have brought has been fairly watered down or non-existant.

FarmRanger - Harper did have discussions and plans with the Bloc to unseat Paul Martin about 4 years ago and I don't think that the Bloc had any different policies and/or intentions than they do now.

Despite more folks voting conservative, they - primarily Harper, still couldn't get a majority -- essentially they just took back some of the seats they had lost in the previous election. He didn't get the "plum" he wanted, so the bullying tactics started and when he got the others sufficiently riled up, he ran away, as most bullies do. (Shouting to try and get others to come to your way of thinking, doesn't do much good either.)

He came out of the election saying he would work with this parliament and immediately started kicking them when they were down. Whether the subsidies were right or wrong didn't matter - he came out of the gates swinging and hid behind mom when things got too rough.

The coalition likely will implode...meanwhile the fiddles are going, Rome is burning and they aren't dealing with the real issues. I vote for prorouging salaries until they come back to the sandbox and play nice together.

As an aside, ask anyone from another country - particularly a European country - and they see nothing wrong with a coalition government. It seems that we do.

[silverback]

Do you know which countries have them or are you just repeating what you heard Jack layton say?

The countries that have coalition governments don't have the cancer of a party whose sole purpose is to destroy that country.

There is no way to justify signing a document that legitimizes the Bloc's ability to control the purse strings of Canada. Just because they "promised" not to act badly while supporting the libs and ndp obscures the fact they were guaranteed oversight of new bills and policies. It is downright stupid to get involved with someone who would take as much of our tax dollars as possible and then split up our country.

How is taking the taxpayer subsidy away from political parties - all of them - a bad thing? Most people think it is the right thing to do. Is that bullying?

They were back in parliment for two weeks. Did you watch any of it? The opposition parties started firing away because the world economy was dropping off and we were headed into a period of deficits. Evil harper couldn't maintain a surplus - remember that? Now they tried a coup and what was their first order of business? Blow 30 Billion out the door of TAXPAYER MONEY!
So 2 weeks ago deficits were bad and now they are ok.?

Maybe try another example of the evil that has been brought upon this land by harper.

[cakadu]

Why bother? You're not listening anyway and have not gotten any of my points. It's okay though, cause it will be a victory.

[silverback]

You were trying to make the point that the mess we are in is all because of the prime minister and him alone. You want him to resign.

Your other point was that the bloc aren't so bad and it would be ok for the opposition to get into bed with them.

No?

If those aren't the two points you have tried to make then I guess my reading abilities need correcting.

[cakadu]

I have never said I want the prime minister to resign, so please go and re-read my posts. Have I said he is responsible for the mess, yes I have.

I have also never said that the Bloc weren't so bad - I've said their agenda has been known since they've become a national political party, which is all about separation. I have never said I support the coalition. Again, go and re-read what I've actually written.

Methinks there has been a little reading between the lines and ad libbing.

Quite frankly, I don't know which is the lesser of the two evils, but I will leave the debate now before I am accused of something else.

[FarmRanger]

Cakadu,
Harper worked with the Bloc to try to oust a government and instigate an election.
Dion and Layton asked the Bloc to join with them to try to overturn the results of an election.
A huge difference in my opinion.

If this unholy alliance succeeds, what’s to stop the losers in every election in the future from supplanting the winning party?

As far as I’m concerned any coalition requiring the support of a party whos main purpose is to break up the country, is illegitimate. This is the stuff of banana republics, not civilized democracies.

[coppertop]

I agree that a coalition to take over governing a country is wrong, and to make that appempt a few short weeks after the country made thier decision at the polls was certainly something we should never expect in Canada.
One thing about it, people are now paying attention to federal politics like never before, and maybe some that sat at home on their backsides will get out and vote next election, which I would guess is a few weeks or months away.
It sounds as though the Liberals have some mediation to do within their party, regarding how they select the replacement for Dion.
And we thought Canadian politics was dull and boring !!

[cakadu]

FarmRanger, if there is a majority then this does not become an issue and a coalition wouldn't even be in the cards.

Your point about the objectives of the two coalitions is well taken and I can agree with it.

What I still have an issue with is that Harper did not see the Bloc as separatists when he was working with them, no matter what the reason. Do you think that if that particular coalition would have succeeded, that the Bloc would not have been asking for any number of things? They are going to do what is right for themselves, not the rest of the country.

Harper spent a lot of time and resources trying to court the people of Quebec over the last 4 years, to no avail. Now he is focusing his efforts on Ontario in an attempt to find himself with a majority.

I agree with copper, this has people paying attention like never before, which isn't a bad thing and may even get some of them off of their duffs the next time an election rolls around.

[FarmRanger]

Agreed cakadu and coppertop, it would be a great thing if people would pay attention to what was going on and not vote based on what was spoon fed to them by their favourite parties.

I guess we’ll have to disagree on the coalition agreement to form a government versus working together to bring on an election. No hard feelings ;-)

Christie Blatchford has an interesting article in the globe and mail at:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20081208.BLATCH08/TPStory/National/columnists

[coppertop]

I think we all need to let our Members of Parliament know we are sick of game playing, and want them to get on with the business of governing the country. If this means to compromise on some issues so they can work with opposition parties so be it. I am a bit concerned whether Harper is the right person to lead a majority government. He is very controlling, has no 'give' to him personality wise, and this past week or so we have seen how that has almost turned the country on it's end.
I am thinking there may be some rumblings within the Conservative caucus, but they will keep it quiet for now.
I am hoping that Harper learned a good lesson from the recent mess, and he and his party don't think Dion leaving means they won any battle of wits !!! In my view it is in the best interest of the country to have a majority government, far too much time spent wrangling over foolish issues.
At least with a Conservative
majority, we may finally see Senate reform, and a few less bleeding heart judges appointed.

[ivbinconned]

One thing that our political and media culture excels at is denying reality.

All this talk about how horrible it is that the Liberals and NDP would welcome the "bloc", the "separatists’" as part of a coalition is nonsense when examined beyond the end of ones nose!

As contrary as this may sound The Bloc has not existed all these years in order to advance a sovereign Quebec.

It was created as a reaction to the Reform party and its purpose has been to extract as much cash as possible from ROC using the “threat”, to achieve that end. It has worked well, with the so called deep thinkers of the rest of the cast, going along with the scam, advancing and keeping this myth alive.

In committee the Bloc has supported the liberals and NDP 90% of the time. They are the Quebec wing of the liberal and NDP parties and it has taken a minority “conservative” party with a western base to finally expose and shine a light for the public, as to this fact. That’s the reality!

The unprecedented LONGEVITY of the Harper minority government has resulted in the players of this charade becoming very uncomfortable. I have said in the past that Harper should have taken us to the polls in a historical time frame. Twelve to fifteen months. I warned that events would overtake him. That’s what the Liberals would have done. In stead, as he has stated, “he liked being prime minister”! His caucus was enjoying the perks of power and they ceased being politically smart.

Also, Quebec separatists were part of the Mulroney coalition so to whine about them taking part in this coalition is wasting energy and intellectually dishonest.

Rather they should concentrate on exposing all this for what it really is, a power grab motivated but an elitist political cast, driven by eastern bigotry!

Remember what Chretien said about dealing with westerners. Was it not Justin’s dad who as PM gave westerners the finger?

The great divide is not between political philosophies, but between the east and the west!